Anybody any suggestions, please, how one minimises BT's astronomical quarterly "Service Charge" of £36.00?

You could try OneTel at £9.75/month (£29.25/qtr) which is a pretty good deal.

If recommended by an existing customer, you will get an invitation email which if you take up, will get you a bonus £20 credit to your account and £20 to the person recommending you.

On top of that you get FREE weekend calls to UK landlines (01 & 02 numbers). See the website for their other price plans. Also I can recommend the Evening & Weekend Plan at £3.99 /month which is brilliant value.

Do you have any additional calling features?  I'm asking because currently BT charge £10.50 a month for those paying by Direct Debit (£31.50/qtr) but this is increasing by 50p to £11 (£33/qtr) in January I believe.  The price increase is discussed in more detail here.

BT offer free Caller display whereas OneTel charge £1.50 for this.

Can you therefore give us an idea what this £36 charge is made up of and when you mostly make your calls (daytime or evening/weekend) because it'll give us a better idea on how to advise you?


DaveM wrote on Dec 30^th, 2005 at 5:52pm:

Also I can recommend the Evening & Weekend Plan at £3.99 /month which is brilliant value.

This isn't really the cheapest option for those that pay BT line rental.  The cheapest Evening&Weekend call packages are with:

Primus Saver which has free/inclusive geographical calls (those beginning 01 or 02) during evenings & weekends with NO monthly fee as does Just-Dial Saver.

As mentioned earlier both don't charge a monthly fee for these inclusive/free evening & weekend minutes and the only differences between these two suppliers are:-

• Planet Talk have a call limit of 1 and a half hours before that (single) call becomes chargable whereas Just-Dial have a 2 hour limit.  To avoid being charged for those long calls then simply disconnect and redial within your time limit to get another 1 and a half (or 2 hours depending on company) again.
  
• Just-Dial and OneTel are both owned by Centrica (who also own British Gas) and TalkTalk have recently purchased both Just-Dial and OneTel and overtime it is expected that both Just-Dial and OneTel customers will be merged/migrated over to TalkTalk's tariff and TalkTalk's tariffs aren't the cheapest.

Thank you DaveM & bbb_uk for your helpful thoughts.

Have look at OneTel.  At the time, they insisted on a combined line rental/calls deal.  It was found their call charges were somewhat high.

Our line rental is with BT Together Option 1 (not that they gave us any option!!) at £36.00/quarter.  There are NO special features like caller display, call back or any of the other BT gimmicks.
Our UK calls are combined with the Tiscali broadband arrangement and cost £4.00/month over and above the basic broadband cost.  Continental calls (to D, F, NL, I) are with 18866 at 2p/minute.

Our Dec05 BT bill totaled £36.56.  £36.00 was for service charge.  £0.56 was for calls to monopolistic 0845 & 087* con numbers.  This was eye-watering and prompted the call for HELP!!

The OneTel E&W package is now 99p a month for new punters.But how long that will last now that they are part of Talk Talk is anyones guess.
Primus Saver does appear to be the best E&W bet.Combine that with  1899 for your peak 01/02 calls,and 18185 for your cheaper mobile calls,for the best prices.

Apart from the fact that caller display is dearer with another supplier,their are a number of other good reasons why its not a great idea to move your line rental from BT.EG:
1. Bt are the only supplier that have to allow you  to call cheaper providers access codes like 1899.other providers can bar them.(If you sign for OneTel line rental you agree to put all your call traffic through them).
2.You cant CPS your calls to  anyone else unless your with  BT.
3.You lose the advantage of using the BT override code 1280 for free to give you cheaper ngn calls(0845/0870) at E&W,and if your with OneTel cheaper 0844 calls at any time.
4.You lose the benefit if you move, of being a BT moving customer.
5.You might get a worst repair service.You have to report faults to them,they pass them on to Bt if appropriate.
6.If you use Call Sign no one else can support it.

Just a thought are you paying in advance and do you pay cash .If so BT line rental from 1/1/2006 for non d/d payers is £12 a mnth so x 3= £36. Otherwise its wrong or your paying for something you are unaware of.

If you pay by d/d Opt1 is £31.50p a quarter prior to 1/1/2006 ,and £33.00 thereafter, as has already been pointed out.

Dont forget to claim your free caller display ;).

Thanks, bigjohn.

We pay by cheque or BACS 2 - 3 weeks after receiving the BT bill.  Have just changed to DD.  Even so, £33.00 is stilll hell of a chunk, is't it?

Talk Talk are putting theirs up to £10.49 a month by d/d in Feb so i guess OneTel will follow.

bigjohn wrote on Dec 31^st, 2005 at 8:43am:

The OneTel E&W package is now 99p a month for new punters.

I think that offer finished earlier in the month - see Landline Rates, where it was shown before it's back to £3.99 !!

I can see that with the takeover I shall probably be changing my supplier soon as well. Heaven knows where I'm going to find another one with the same benefits !  Now we have to wait for them to change the prices & T&C's and I will be one of the first to get out !!

rydaway wrote on Dec 30^th, 2005 at 4:13pm:

Anybody any suggestions, please, how one minimises BT's astronomical quarterly "Service Charge" of £36.00?

That's only £12 / month.

How many contract mobiles can you get for less than that ?

But that £12 a month is before you get anything else. Least if your paying £12 a month on a mobile, you get 'free' mins with it.

Yes, joe65, you are right with your coment "That's only £12 / month. ".  It was the disproportionate  BT line rental/call charge in our Dec05 BT bill (see earlier pse) which precipitated this thread.

There are now many others providing a service for calls.  The original enquiry was to ask if anybody has knowledge of others providing a line rental service.  The only other landline provider appears to be OneTel.  When they were "looked at", their call charges were quite high.  A quick glance at their web site this mng suggested their service is littered with small print and conditions, afor example :

Onetel residential landline customer?
Requested a single UKTalk plan on or after 23rd February 2005?
Have received your Onetel bill for a single UKTalk plan?
Still have a UKTalk call plan on your Onetel account?
BT bill covers same phone number as registered on UKTalk?
Used BT for all calls prior to requesting UKTalk?
Have not already challenged the UKTalk Guarantee?
Onetel account not currently blocked for non-payment of bills?
Can enclose the quarterly (or three monthly) BT Together bill(s) in your name, for the three months prior to requesting a UKTalk plan

mc661 wrote on Jan 1^st, 2006 at 7:20am:

But that £12 a month is before you get anything else. Least if your paying £12 a month on a mobile, you get 'free' mins with it.

True, but isn't BT's now compulsory Option1 6p for an hour off-peak roughly an equivalent .
Not to mention calls being a lot cheaper than from a Mobile, & Vodafone now tell me they're going to put my £12/month up to £13 ?

rydaway wrote on Jan 1^st, 2006 at 8:43am:

The only other landline provider appears to be OneTel.

What about Talk Talk ,Post Office Home Phone, Toucan, and Homecall to name but four of the providers now providing line rental.

bigjohn wrote on Jan 5^th, 2006 at 11:28pm:

rydaway wrote on Jan 1st, 2006 at 8:43am:  The only other landline provider appears to be OneTel.   What about Talk Talk ,Post Office Home Phone, Toucan, and Homecall to name but four of the providers now providing line rental.

Am grateful to you, bigjohn.  Will follow up, thanks.

bigjohn wrote on Jan 5^th, 2006 at 11:28pm:

What about Talk Talk ,Post Office Home Phone, Toucan, and Homecall to name but four of the providers now providing line rental.

I've just been handed a leaflet at the Post Office promoting HomePhone and offering £50 'cash back'.

It claims:

• "Line rental from only £9.95 [Direct Debit] per month.  Lower than BT."
  
• "And don't worry, other call features are charged at exactly the same price as BT charge you now.  (Excludes BT calling feature packs)."
  

So I called them (freephone) and asked, "Does this mean that Caller ID (BT Privacy) is free?"  Answer: "No, it's £1.70 per month."  (Had to call them 'cos I couldn't find calling feature charges on their website.)

So, as I suspected (and discussed in other messages on this forum), comparing, like with like, line rental inclusive of Caller ID: BT £11.00; PO £11.65.

While the PO might get away with claiming "Cheaper line rental than BT" (the basic charge is cheaper if you don't want Caller ID), I don't think they should get away with claiming "call features are charged at exactly the same price as BT charge you now".

I see a complaint to Advertising Standards coming on ...

I also asked them whether one can use alternative carriers (e.g. 1899, etc.) - and again, not surprisingly, the answer was "No".

So, to rydaway and others looking for an alternative line rental provider - be careful about what alternative you are buying.

trevord wrote on Jan 6^th, 2006 at 5:45pm:

bigjohn wrote on Jan 5th, 2006 at 11:28pm: What about Talk Talk ,Post Office Home Phone, Toucan, and Homecall to name but four of the providers now providing line rental. .............................. So, as I suspected (and discussed in other messages on this forum), comparing, like with like, line rental inclusive of Caller ID: BT £11.00; PO £11.65. ..................................... I also asked them whether one can use alternative carriers (e.g. 1899, etc.) - and again, not surprisingly, the answer was "No". So, to rydaway and others looking for an alternative line rental provider - be careful about what alternative you are buying.

Mny tks, trevord.  Ain't done anything all day other than sort the **** computer out.  Guess it got a bug.  Quite serious - reformat of HD needed!  Thank goodness for backups!!

One assumes all who offer alternative line rental won't allow "other" providers so don't intend to waste time at the moment 'phoning round / delving through web sites.

Will be interesting to see what sort of response you get to the letter which is ". . coming on. . ."   When I jumped up and down about 18866 increasing connection fee from 2p to 3p to 4p, nobody was interested - it is a ". . . commercial decision within the terms of their T&C of service."

 Some more good reasons why its not a good idea to move your line rental from Bt in this recent thread on MSE   http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=132216


Plus T T are now charging for basic 1571 see here
http://www.saynoto0870.com/cgi-bin/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1136567054

bigjohn wrote on Jan 5^th, 2006 at 11:28pm:

What about Talk Talk ,Post Office Home Phone, Toucan, and Homecall to name but four of the providers now providing line rental.

None of these have line rental that is more than a pound or two cheaper a quarter than BT's headline £33 a quarter after the price increase.  And all of these other companies bar you from using services like 1899 and 18185 and even good old BT on 1280 (BT being generally cheapest for 0845 in particular).  And all these companies have a charge for Caller Display that makes the total line rental higher than BT if you are on  BT Privacy which gives free Caller Display.  Once you are with one of these companies you can only get cheap call prices using dial through companies like www.dialaround.co.uk and www.bestminutes.co.uk but all of these charge you 5p each time you call the dial through number, even if your call is not connected through to your destination at the other end.

BT's line rental is a disgraceful scam as I am in a rural area and there is no alternative if you also need broadband.  The water company here only charges £5.50 a quarter for their pipe and meter so why does BT's copper wire cost £33.

In fact BT have a scheme called Light User at £9.50 a quarter for which I meet all their criteria except for having broadband on the line and having a mobile (I could possible be untruthful about the latter but not the former which their BT Wholesale clearly knows about even though my broadband is from Freedom2Surf).

Ofcom had a review of BT's valuation of its copper wire network a while ago which led to it signing off BT's disgraceful quarterly rental charges.  But why does BT not have a "no standing charge" option with higher unit costs as gas and electricity companies do?  Answer because the useless Ofcom lets BT get away with it. ;) >:(

rydaway wrote on Dec 30^th, 2005 at 4:13pm:

Anybody any suggestions, please, how one minimises BT's astronomical quarterly "Service Charge" of £36.00?

Suggest you write an email putting that question to the following:-

stephen.carter@ofcom.org.uk
sean.wiliams@ofcom.org.uk
kip.meek@ofcom.org.uk

Especially draw attention to the fact that BT's Wholesale Line Rental scheme is a pile of junk and not resulting in quarterly line rental that is actually any cheaper from BT's competitors.   Tell them that in the real world that most people also use some Network Services like especially Caller Display and BT must be forced to make Caller Display free for all phone users on its own line rental or on competitor line rental products.  Also ask why Caller Display is a free service even on a Pay as You Go mobile phone.

wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 10:19am:

rydaway wrote on Dec 30th, 2005 at 4:13pm: Anybody any suggestions, please, how one minimises BT's astronomical quarterly "Service Charge" of £36.00? Suggest you write an email putting that question to the following:- stephen.carter@ofcom.org.uk sean.wiliams@ofcom.org.uk kip.meek@ofcom.org.uk Especially draw attention to the fact that BT's Wholesale Line Rental scheme is a pile of junk and not resulting in quarterly line rental that is actually any cheaper from BT's competitors.   Tell them that in the real world that most people also use some Network Services like especially Caller Display and BT must be forced to make Caller Display free for all phone users on its own line rental or on competitor line rental products.  Also ask why Caller Display is a free service even on a Pay as You Go mobile phone.

Thanks;  have already contacted Stephen C and got standard fob-off response number "21".

What about all of us sending a similar message, to all the guys you suggest, on the same day?  If you would be happy to prepare a suitable script and arrange a timing,  NonGeographicalMan, you can certainly count me in.
Does this board/site allow a facility to email contact all who have registered to the site to spread the idea?

wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 10:13am:

bigjohn wrote on Jan 5th, 2006 at 11:28pm: What about Talk Talk ,Post Office Home Phone, Toucan, and Homecall to name but four of the providers now providing line rental. None of these have line rental that is more than a pound or two cheaper a quarter than BT's headline £33 a quarter after the price increase.  And all of these other companies bar you from using services like 1899 and 18185 and even good old BT on 1280 (BT being generally cheapest for 0845 in particular).  And all these companies have a charge for Caller Display that makes the total line rental higher than BT if you are on  BT Privacy which gives free Caller Display.  Once you are with one of these companies you can only get cheap call prices using dial through companies like www.dialaround.co.uk and www.bestminutes.co.uk but all of these charge you 5p each time you call the dial through number, even if your call is not connected through to your destination at the other end.

When i mentioned them i was in no way advocating that they were a good bet in fact far from it.I was just responding to rydaways post of 1/1/2006.

Other things to be considered are.

Talk Talk are increaseing line rental to £10.50 on 1/2/006. TT charge for basic 1571 50p a month BT dont.
None of them support call sign. Some have minute billing eg Homecall i believe.You lose the BT moving home deal.You cant cps your calls to get things like free evening and weekend calls,Last but not least your fault response might suffer.

bigjohn wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 10:46am:

When i mentioned i was in no way advocating that they were a good bet in fact far from it.I was just responding to

Yes I realised that bigjohn.  I was just keen to discourage rydaway from doing something he might regret.

wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 10:54am:

bigjohn wrote on Jan 13th, 2006 at 10:46am: When i mentioned i was in no way advocating that they were a good bet in fact far from it.I was just responding to Yes I realised that bigjohn.  I was just keen to discourage rydaway from doing something he might regret.

Thanks. Like you i do think the BT Service charge is excessive!!!

rydaway wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 10:39am:

Thanks;  have already contacted Stephen C and got standard fob-off response number "21". What about all of us sending a similar message, to all the guys you suggest, on the same day?  If you would be happy to prepare a suitable script and arrange a timing,  NonGeographicalMan, you can certainly count me in. Does this board/site allow a facility to email contact all who have registered to the site to spread the idea?

Mr Carter does seem to think he is far too important to ever have any direct communication with the mere citizens and consumers he is there to represent as his no 1 obligation and who pay most of his salary.  I can't really recommend anything amounting to an email petition as those are usually seen to be the work of one individual and treated as such.  A steady drip.drip of indiviudal emails is more likely to wear them down.

I would recommend more of you lodging a complaint with BT Complaints Review Service (but you have to make complaint to customer services on 150 and then a supervisor first before you can go there) about the fact that BT Light User Scheme is not made available to those of you who make very few calls on your line with BT just because you have broadband too.  Ideally reach Deadlock on this with BT and escalate on to Otelo.

See www.bt.com/customerservices/cust_details.jsp?parentcat=cs_complaint_service&childcat=complaint_review

wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 10:54am:

bigjohn wrote on Jan 13th, 2006 at 10:46am: When i mentioned i was in no way advocating that they were a good bet in fact far from it.I was just responding to Yes I realised that bigjohn.  I was just keen to discourage rydaway from doing something he might regret.

Tks, NonGeographicalMan, your guidance was followed.  As others don't allow alternative service providers, have no option but to keep with BT for line rental.  There was a time, some years back, when users of an alternative service provider were able to enjoy BT's light user line rental.  This all disappeared when the local exchange went digital.

OK, will drip, drip, drip.

rydaway wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 11:41am:

OK, will drip, drip, drip

I suggest writing to your MP setting out why you think that Ofcom is failing in its duties under Section 3 (i) of the Communications Act 2003 to take action in the best interests of the uk citizen and uk consumer.   See www.ofcom.org.uk/about/sdrp/

Since the only people Ofcom are accountable to are Parliament as a whole (incredibly they are not accountable to either an Ombudsman or a Minister) your MP is the person who has the most power to call Ofcom to account.

I think pointing out that there is no cheap line rental scheme for people who only need their BT copper wire for broadband service and could make all their phone calls via voip is a very worthwhile point to make.  As is the fact that there is no cheap line rental scheme for people who are less well off but need to make a normal amount of phone calls (very likely with an unemployed or sick or elderly person based at home al the time who in fact constitute most of the least well off).

See www.writetothem.com to write to your MP online

wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 11:09am:

I would recommend more of you lodging a complaint with BT Complaints Review Service [...] about the fact that BT Light User Scheme is not made available to those of you who make very few calls on your line with BT just because you have broadband too.  [...]

Information on Light User Scheme is available in PDF here.

In summary, main points of LUS are:

• Line rental is £12 per month, whether paid by Direct Debit or not. BT Together Option 1 is available for £12 per month if not paying by DD and £11 if paying by DD.
  
• Not eligable for Friends and Family.
  
• Call charges distinguish between local and national numbers, as they did on BT Standard.
  
• A rebate is available if call charges are below £17.71 inc VAT (£15.07 exc VAT). Details in the link above.

I don't agree that LUS should be opened up to everyone because it was devised for light-users of the telephone network. Just because it suits some better than the current offering is no basis to say that it's unfair that everyone can't use it.

Instead, I think that the best approach would be to complain/question Ofcom as to why it is that competition hasn't brought down the price of mainstream lines below that of LUS, rendering it pointless. This is the reals crooks of the matter, and highlights what a joke the residential telecommunications market has turned out to be in this country.

What's also not been pointed out on here is how LUS line rental has been pushed up in line with other 'competitive' packages. There is no competition amongst light user schemes because there is only one of them! Thus, there is no competitive force to push the price down for 'light users'. AFAIK, in essence the LUS has remained the same apart from the line rental charge. This has risen from £9.50* when BT Standard existed to £12 per month, in line with the 'mainstream'/'standard' line rental charges. Why is it that these 'competitive forces', which seem intent on pushing up the cost of a telephone line, also apply to LUS?

* This was the price with £1 discount for paying by Direct Debit. Was this discount provided or was it £10.50 for everyone?

Dave wrote on Jan 13^th, 2006 at 3:32pm:

Line rental is £12 per month, whether paid by Direct Debit or not. BT Together Option 1 is available for £12 per month if not paying by DD and £11 if paying by DD

Dave,

I am surprised to find that you of all people do not appear to understand how the BT Light User scheme works.

According to Page 5 of the PDF booklet you provided the link to you receive a discount of 11.9p for ever 10p your total quarterly call bill (before VAT) is below £17.10.  But if your total quarterly call bill before VAT is between £10.59 and £15.07 (before VAT) you receive a rebate of £7.04 (before VAT) and If your call bill before VAT per quarter is £15.08 or above you are charged the full rental of £36 (including VAT) even though you have paid BT Standard call charges.  So if one assumes a customer who  just wants the line rental for Voip on broadband and wants to make all calls using Voip then a total possible rebate of 171 x 11.9p = £20.35 + VAT saving of £3.56 = £23.91 is achievable if no calls are made on the line.  This leaves you with a residual line rental of £12.09 to pay compared to the full £36 without discount.  I'm not quite sure of the logic of how this discount works as I see the other line discount scheme (In Contact Plus) now costs £10.75 per quarter inc VAT ( see www.bt.com/customerservices/downloads/in_contact_plus.pdf ) and I thought BT Light User and IN Contact Plus both previously had the same quarterly cost of £9.50 inc VAT if no calls were made.  The point of In Contact Plus is that no outgoing calls can be dialled on the line in the normal way except for 999, 100, 112 and 150 and everything else has to be done through a speciall calling card with a PIN.  This allows the line owner to keep better control over the line not being used unnecessarily that Light User but the same ridiculous restrictions on not having broadband, owning a mobile, using another phone service and so on apply.

So Dave it seems your knowledge is incomplete as for anyone who just wants their line for broadband and to only use Voip the cost of Light User or In Contact Plus line rental is hugely lower if only BT allowed you to have these line rental schemes with broadband.

I am rather amazed to think you imagined that the Light User Scheme cost all its customers £36 a quarter in addition to higher call costs as I had rather come to think of you as our telecoms guru in this forum. :o

wrote on Jan 14^th, 2006 at 9:38am:

[...] So if one assumes a customer who  just wants the line rental for Voip on broadband and wants to make all calls using Voip then a total possible rebate of 171 x 11.9p = £20.35 + VAT saving of £3.56 = £23.91 is achievable if no calls are made on the line.  This leaves you with a residual line rental of £12.09 to pay compared to the full £36 without discount. [...] I am rather amazed to think you imagined that the Light User Scheme cost all its customers £36 a quarter in addition to higher call costs as I had rather come to think of you as our telecoms guru in this forum. :o

I hadn't considered it like that. So that's an equivalent of £4.03 per month then.

But the fact still remains that BT has pushed up the price of LUS by £1.50 (or £2.50 if there was a discount for paying DD) in the last 18 months. I appreciate that's not a lot compared to what most of us have had to put up with, but it's still pushing up the cost of a telephone for all. It is an outrage that a basic telephone line costs 50% more than it did on 30 June 2004. This isn't progress!

Dave wrote on Jan 14^th, 2006 at 4:10pm:

But the fact still remains that BT has pushed up the price of LUS by £1.50 (or £2.50 if there was a discount for paying DD) in the last 18 months. I appreciate that's not a lot compared to what most of us have had to put up with, but it's still pushing up the cost of a telephone for all. It is an outrage that a basic telephone line costs 50% more than it did on 30 June 2004. This isn't progress!

Yes it does seem hard to understand BT being allowed to impose a similar monetary value increase on In Contact Plus line rental (£1.25 versus £1.50) when it amounts to a far, far, larger amount in percentage terms than on Option 1.  And surely given the hugely narrow criteria for qualifying for the Light User Scheme and In Contact Plus these really will be the very poorest members of the community.  I suspect that Ofcom didn't even realise that by removing the cap on BT line rental increases above inflation, in a pathetic attempt to try to make Wholesale Line Rental products look cheaper, that they were also saying yes to these much larger rises on InContactPlus and Light User.

What I can't understand is that in gas and electrcity I can choose betweeen 10 or 15 suppliers and numerous different tariff options on each (yes even here in the deep countryside) including a No Standing Charge option with higher unit price as well as a standing charge option with lower unit price.  But with the phone if I need to have broadband here in the countryside but do not need BT PSTN facility my only option is BT Option 1 at £33 a quarter.  A service that 18 months ago cost £28.50 a quarter as BT Standard with £6.50 call rebate (so £22 net).  I also can't understand why Ofcom hasn't insisted on a lower cost line rental option without having to pay for a BT customer discount scheme for CPS customers and any other customers who route all calls away from BT (eg 1899 customers)

The only conclusion is that Ofcom is just totally incompetent so it likes to content itself with thinking it has achieved something whilst achieving absolutely nothing at all.  In fact it has probably made things even worse than before it started meddling.

Please what is the 1280 override code. I think this website is great but sometimes I get the feeling that you forget about us "Non techies" and don't explain things enough.

reggie wrote on Jan 20^th, 2006 at 11:43am:

Please what is the 1280 override code. I think this website is great but sometimes I get the feeling that you forget about us "Non techies" and don't explain things enough.

1280 is the code you dial on front of the normal number to route your call via BT if you have CPS (Carrier Pre-Selection) on your BT line so that all calls are routed with Tiscali, Toucan, TalkTalk etc without you having to dial the code.  1280 doesn't work if you have transferred your entire line rental including to someone else like TalkTalk, Tiscali or Toucan Telecom.  Your only option then are the dial through services like www.dialaround.co.uk where you dial and 084, 087 or 09 number to make cheap calls.  The snag theer is you pay 5 each time even if your call is not connectedl

A search for 1280 and BT under UK only at Google brings up over 10 pages of results...............................

reggie wrote on Jan 20^th, 2006 at 11:43am:

Please what is the 1280 override code. I think this website is great but sometimes I get the feeling that you forget about us "Non techies" and don't explain things enough.

"1280 doesn't work if you have transferred your entire line rental including to someone else like TalkTalk, Tiscali or Toucan Telecom."

NonGeoMan.

Its my understanding that it does still work as such,but you are billed top wack by your supplier for using it.

See this extract from Homecall line rental T&C.

4.7 Where You make a telephone call by dialling the “BT Break Out Code” (1280) and You have the Homecall Line Rental Service, We will raise Call Charges in respect of that call at the then current standard BT day time retail rate or at Our then current Call Charge rate, whichever is the higher, for the telephone number dialled.

Post Office and TalkTalk both assured me that 1280 would not operate and that I could not route calls with BT or any other indirect or CPS call carriers.

wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 12:38am:

Post Office and TalkTalk both assured me that 1280 would not operate and that I could not route calls with BT or any other indirect or CPS call carriers.

From what i have read around the web.

You can still use short codes like 1899,18866 with the likes of PO ,TT, Onetel etc although they dont actively encourage it,and can bar you if they so desire.But it still works at moment.But even if they bar the short code could they bar the free phone access numbers of these providers? Bulldog are blocking codes, but freephone access still works.

As you point out you cant truly CPS your calls to another provider if you move your line rental from BT.

As i said, i think 1280 still works but it cannot be charged by BT as you dont have an a/c with them.So i assume thats why your supplier charges you.(Its not just Homecall i have seen it mentioned for other line rental suppliers as well).

bigjohn wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 1:11am:

You can still use short codes like 1899,18866 with the likes of PO ,TT, Onetel etc although they dont actively encourage it,and can bar you if they so desire.But it still works at moment.But even if they bar the short code could they bar the free phone access numbers of these providers? Bulldog are blocking codes, but freephone access still works.

Well it makes me more inclined to go with the Post Office and their £50 Cashback for line rental then.  Although after £15.75 cost for Caller ID for three quarters I suppose this reduces the saving to £35 or so.  Anyhow I keep meaning to get one of these ATA thingies to go to Voip but I'm slightly put off by it costing as much as a whole year's calls with 1899. :o

If the worst comes to the worst there are still a lot of dial through providers for getting the best rates on overseas calls but clearly the best rates on uk calls are only available on Voip.  Anyhow the Post Office tells me that you get the second £25 Cashback on the third bill which you get just over 6 months after you join them - they send the first bill as soon as you join and the £25 Cashbacks are on the 2nd and 3rd bills.  This seems better than TalkTalk where you have to stay a whole year to get all the Cashback.  And as I understand it they credit me with the Cashback automatically - I don't have to send in the bill to ask.  And armed with this saving I would then be able to afforc to buy my ATA adapter. ;)  Hopefully after 6 months with the Post Office some other phone provider may be offering a nice Cash Back offer for WLR and so on and so forth................

Looks like my relationship with JustDial may be shortlived.  I see TalkTalk once again have not sent me a letter notifying me of the transfer of my CPS service to them though.  It really is a disgrace that Ofcom can't make a telephone company even this big and important comply with its rules.  Ofcom still just hopes that everyone will be a "jolly decent chap"

bigjohn wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 12:29am:

4.7 Where You make a telephone call by dialling the “BT Break Out Code” (1280) and You have the Homecall Line Rental Service, We will raise Call Charges in respect of that call at the then current standard BT day time retail rate or at Our then current Call Charge rate, whichever is the higher, for the telephone number dialled.

So, if they are going to charge you the higher rate of the two, then the ability to route a call via BT using 1280 is less than useless.


bigjohn wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 1:11am:

1280 ... cannot be charged by BT as you dont have an a/c with them.

Good point - hadn't thought of that!


bigjohn wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 1:11am:

As i said, i think 1280 still works ...

I think it's misleading to say it "still works":

• As you've pointed out, BT can't bill you.
  
• You only get charged the BT rate if it's higher.
  
• Hence the whole point of using an alternative carrier to route the call, i.e. to get a lower call rate, is defeated.
  
• So, as I've said above, the theoretical ability to choose BT via 1280 is less than useless.
  

bigjohn wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 1:11am:

You can still use short codes like 1899,18866 with the likes of PO ,TT, Onetel etc ...

Can you please indicate whether you are stating this from personal experience of merely "from what  [you] have read around the web."?
I would be interested if anyone can confirm that 1899, 18185, etc. are definately still available with the PO HomePhone service.


bigjohn wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 1:11am:

But it still works at moment.But even if they bar the short code could they bar the free phone access numbers of these providers?

Presumably they could bar the freephone access numbers?  Even if they don't, these are still more expensive than dialling 1899, etc. directly - but could still be worthwhile with the cash-back.

The problem would presumably be if you swapped to the PO service on the basis of it being cheaper to use overall in conjunction with the 1899 freephone numbers, and then the PO barred those numbers before you'd got your cashback!

trevord wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 11:54am:

The problem would presumably be if you swapped to the PO service on the basis of it being cheaper to use overall in conjunction with the 1899 freephone numbers, and then the PO barred those numbers before you'd got your cashback!

It would be wise to plan to switch to moving to making calls using www.voipcheap.co.uk if one moves across to the Post Office's line rental deal.  I do feel that the Post Office is a less thoroughly deceitful and badly organised outfit than CPW/TalkTalk.  Their customer service centre is on an 0800 number for instance and calls seem to be answered almost instantaneously.

wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 12:03pm:

It would be wise to plan to switch to moving to making calls using www.voipcheap.co.uk if one moves across to the Post Office's line rental deal.

That's not a bad idea - I hadn't linked the two things together.

On the other hand, VoIP is not practicable in certain circumstances, e.g.:

• one person on the computer and another on the 'phone;
  
• two 'phone lines, with one person on each line at the same time;
  
• talking on the 'phone with a cordless 'phone while cooking dinner, etc. (unless you can have bluetooth / other radio connection between a headset and the computer?)
  

I have used Skype in the past for Skype-to-Skype calls, but hadn't thought VoIP to be significantly cheaper than 1899, etc. to make it worthwhile using for calls to regular telephone numbers, domestic or N.America.  But it might be worth another look when I replace my 4-year old laptop which is too slow and full for much more!


wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 12:03pm:

I do feel that the Post Office is a less thoroughly deceitful and badly organised outfit than CPW/TalkTalk.

Yes, that's probably true despite their misleading claim of call features being the same price as BT.

I note that they do not list the cost of 0844, 0871 & other misc. numbers on their website, altho' they do list them in a PDF file.

Incidentally and interestingly, on the 'Call Rates' page of their website, there is a drop-down box labelled "Premium rate and other numbers" where the only numbers listed in the drop-down list are 0870, 0845, 0820, 0808, 0800, and Directory enquiries 118xxx numbers - specifically NO 07 or 09 numbers are listed.  This seems to be consistent with the growing implicit recogition that 0870 & 0845 are really premium numbers.

Who are "CPW", please?

trevord wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 4:29pm:

Who are "CPW", please?

CarPhone Warehouse.

Heinz wrote on Jan 21^st, 2006 at 8:08pm:

CarPhone Warehouse.

Thanks!  That had dawned on me during the evening when I heard an advert for their TalkTalk.  I had forgotten that they did TalkTalk.