I recently emailed my local Police Force stating that I could not agree with the statement on their website that
...
     "non-emergency number 0845 60 60 222.  (This is a local rate telephone number.)"

I have not yet had a reply to my email, but it seems to have caused some action!!

The website now states ...

    "non-emergency number 0845 60 60 222.  (This is a national local rate telephone number.)"


Please will you let me have your interpretations of that!!

~ Thread title changed by Dave to include the police force's name

You are welcome to use all or part of the below in your next correspondence:

I have a BT line but use call1899.co.uk to make my peak calls to 01 and 02 numbers for 3p each (as long as I want for a fixed fee of 3p).  I also have a package with Primus which gives me free calls to 01 and 02 numbers off-peak. However, instead of 3p per call peak, I have to pay 3p per minute for 0845 calls (it's less off-peak but the rip-off is the same because anything more than the nothing I normally [don't] have to pay is too expensive in my book).

Ignore me though, consider the poor pensioner who has no home telephone and has to make his or her calls from a telephone box.

To call a standard 01 or 02 number, the telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p buys a call of up to 15 minutes duration - probably easily long enough for most calls.

If the 'target' number is an 0845 number, that telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p buys only the 10p 'connection charge' and 2 time periods - each of 55 seconds.  Consequently, that same 30p minimum charge would run out after only 1 minute 50 seconds - probably just time enough to hear the first set of "Press this, press that" instructions on one of those awful automated systems.

So consider what that 15 minute call would cost if it had to be to an 0845 number instead of an 01 or 02 number.

There are just over 16 periods of 55 second in 15 minutes so, at 10p for each, the call would cost the telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p plus 15 more time periods at 10p each.

OK, I'll save you the bother - £1.80

How much loose change do you carry?

That's why 0845 numbers are evil - they rip us all off and they rip off the less-fortunate proportionately more.

Wicked wrote on Mar 14^th, 2006 at 4:36pm:

You are welcome to use all or part of the below in your next correspondence: I have a BT line but use call1899.co.uk to make my peak calls to 01 and 02 numbers for 3p each (as long as I want for a fixed fee of 3p).  I also have a package with Primus which gives me free calls to 01 and 02 numbers off-peak. However, instead of 3p per call peak, I have to pay 3p per minute for 0845 calls (it's less off-peak but the rip-off is the same because anything more than the nothing I normally [don't] have to pay is too expensive in my book). Ignore me though, consider the poor pensioner who has no home telephone and has to make his or her calls from a telephone box. To call a standard 01 or 02 number, the telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p buys a call of up to 15 minutes duration - probably easily long enough for most calls. If the 'target' number is an 0845 number, that telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p buys only the 10p 'connection charge' and 2 time periods - each of 55 seconds.  Consequently, that same 30p minimum charge would run out after only 1 minute 50 seconds - probably just time enough to hear the first set of "Press this, press that" instructions on one of those awful automated systems. So consider what that 15 minute call would cost if it had to be to an 0845 number instead of an 01 or 02 number. There are just over 16 periods of 55 second in 15 minutes so, at 10p for each, the call would cost the telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p plus 15 more time periods at 10p each. OK, I'll save you the bother - £1.80 How much loose change do you carry? That's why 0845 numbers are evil - they rip us all off and they rip off the less-fortunate proportionately more.

Wonderful! ;D - can you also work our a stock answer for 0870?

Both these descriptions are blatently misleading and are apparently just trying to cover up the fact that it will now cost the majority of citizens more to call than on the 'old' numbers.

I think what it is trying to imply by saying "national local rate" is that it is charged at a local rate from any UK location.

The offending police force in question is Humberside and the contact page with this information is here.

How ironic is it then, that there is currently a commercial on local radio promoting Humberside Police Force's 0845 number that says "Support your local police force buy calling..."?

May I also offer you 2 brief extracts from the Central Office of Information (COI) advice to 'governmental organisations and departments':


Quote:

3.53  0845 in particular has been known as 'local rate' - however with increased competition in the marketplace and resultant changes in tariff structures, these rates will often be in excess of normal local rates that citizens might be charged on their package. 0845 (and 0844) costs through phone boxes and some mobile tariffs can also be expensive to the citizen and this should also be considered. 3.57  You should always clearly communicate the cost to customers on publicity materials (see paragraph 3.75) and this should not use any misleading terms such as 'local', 'national rate', etc.

farci wrote on Mar 14^th, 2006 at 4:57pm:

Wonderful! ;D - can you also work our a stock answer for 0870?

Of course (it's very similar really):

I have a BT line but use call1899.co.uk to make my peak calls to 01 and 02 numbers for 3p each (as long as I want for a fixed fee of 3p).  I also have a package with Primus which gives me free calls to 01 and 02 numbers off-peak. However, instead of 3p per call peak, I have to pay 7.51p per minute for 0870 calls (it's less off-peak but the rip-off is the same because anything more than the nothing I normally [don't] have to pay is too expensive in my book).

Ignore me though, consider the poor pensioner who has no home telephone and has to make his or her calls from a telephone box.

To call a standard 01 or 02 number, the telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p buys a call of up to 15 minutes duration - probably easily long enough for most calls.

If the 'target' number is an 0870 number, that telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p buys only the 10p 'connection charge' and 2 time periods - each of 55 seconds.  Consequently, that same 30p minimum charge would run out after only 1 minute 50 seconds - probably just time enough to hear the first set of "Press this, press that" instructions on one of those awful automated systems.

So consider what that 15 minute call would cost if it had to be to an 0870 number instead of an 01 or 02 number.

There are just over 16 periods of 55 second in 15 minutes so, at 10p for each, the call would cost the telephone box flat rate minimum charge of 30p plus 15 more time periods at 10p each.

OK, I'll save you the bother - £1.80

How much loose change do you carry?

That's why 0870 numbers are evil - they rip us all off and they rip off the less-fortunate proportionately more.

Hi again

Just to add a little more to this thread, here is part of the email I sent .....


"I have checked the various call charges made by my telephone provider (Kingston Communications) and discover that charges to call your number are 3.95p per minute during the day.

It actually costs me nothing for a genuine "local call" within the Kingston area.

Indeed the cost of a national call (to 01 & 02 prefix geographic numbers) is 3p per minute during the day time, which is less than your so-called "local rate".


I believe that 0845 numbers are classed as "Special Services:Lower Rate", and therefore to describe them as "local rate" is totally misleading."



Dave - you are correct about which force it is, but being an old-fashioned pedantic Yorkshireman I still refuse to use the "H" word - I do not live on the side of a river >:(

Dave wrote on Mar 14^th, 2006 at 5:11pm:

Both these descriptions are blatently misleading and are apparently just trying to cover up the fact that it will now cost the majority of citizens more to call than on the 'old' numbers. I think what it is trying to imply by saying "national local rate" is that it is charged at a local rate from any UK location. The offending police force in question is Humberside and the contact page with this information is here. How ironic is it then, that there is currently a commercial on local radio promoting Humberside Police Force's 0845 number that says "Support your local police force buy calling..."?

Specially if they spell it like that!

Golf_Paul wrote on Mar 14^th, 2006 at 8:22pm:

"I have checked the various call charges made by my telephone provider (Kingston Communications) and discover that charges to call your number are 3.95p per minute during the day. It actually costs me nothing for a genuine "local call" within the Kingston area.

So a call to 0845 costs 3.95p/min during the daytime on KC versus 3p/min on BT? Also, KC still distinguish between local and national calls then?

Pricing information for KC is here. This looks to be its equivalent of The BT Price List.

What are KC's packages like, compared to BT's who most basic tariff for most subscribers is BT Together Option 1? Going by the above link I provided, am I right in assuming that the equivalent tariffs are the KC Talk 1 to 4 plans?


Golf_Paul wrote on Mar 14^th, 2006 at 8:22pm:

Dave - you are correct about which force it is, but being an old-fashioned pedantic Yorkshireman I still refuse to use the "H" word - I do not live on the side of a river >:(

I've altered the thread title to contain the force's name. I suppose it's quite apt that a force known as 'Humberside' has adopted a non-geographical telephone code! :-X

Here's a link to the KC Plan I am on ...

http://www.kcom.com/kctalk/yourplanchatter.html

Note the exclusions!

I have spoken to KC Customer Services in the past and they have confirmed that calls made by me to 0845 numbers cost 3.95 per min (daytime).  KC class them as KC Code "S18" "Special Services:Lower Rate"

Costs (p/min inc VAT) Day 3.95  Evening 1.48 Weekend 1.0



@ Dave - thanks for the "H" word - not  :'(

Following on from the thread on police forces jumping on the 0845 bandwagon, I am writing "Humberside" Police Authority about this. I have dug out a letter from "Humberside" Police that I received back in 2005 which states that they pay to receive calls at 0.5 pence per call !!!

Those on KC Talk packages pay nothing extra for local numbers, even on the most basic package, KC Talk 1.

Press release on Kingston Communications website, dated 10 October 2007:

http://www.kcom.com/mediacentre/news/news_article.asp?ArticleID=DA_187836


Quote:

Humberside Police Force speeds up call response for citizens    * UK Force to run 999 calls over Nortel IP Communications network with new call handling service implemented by Affiniti Humberside Police Force (HPF), has launched a new call handling system at three 24-hour contact centres to dramatically improve response times for emergency and non-emergency calls from the public. Deployed with communications integrator Affiniti, the new Nortel IP network and call handling system at the Hessle and Grimsby sites is one of the first to support 999 calls in the UK. It will boost the Force’s productivity and speed of response to all types of citizen interactions - benefiting over 900,000 Humberside residents. Over 90% of HPF’s communication with the public takes place over the phone and contact centre agents handle over 60,000 inbound calls a month. Calls must be answered quickly and channelled accurately in line with Government response time standards and to maintain public safety. The new solution allows HPF to record citizen interactions, access caller history and view information across departments on a single screen rather than having to use different programs and monitors. By bringing intelligence to contact centre agents more effectively, they can make informed decisions on their response to the call more quickly.