Beyond belief really

Police lose grip on violent man

http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/display.var.1172626.0.police_lose_grip_of_violent_man.php

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A VIOLENT man who escaped police custody last year is still on the run almost five months later, it emerged today.

He was wanted by officers from the Metropolitan Police Middle Market Drugs Project for drug trafficking offences.

Anyone with information is asked to contact the project team on 0870 785 7329.
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Are they totally and utterly oblivious of the COI guidelines or do they only run under those of the lousy PITO and your old nemesis Philip Webb idb?

In view of their abandonment of the 101 Single Non Emergency Number I'm sure the time is now ripe for some FOIs to the Police about their plans to adopt the new 03 numbers in place of their current disgusting plethora of 084/7 rate calls.

NGMsGhost wrote on Feb 7^th, 2007 at 6:18am:

Are they totally and utterly oblivious of the COI guidelines or do they only run under those of the lousy PITO and your old nemesis Philip Webb idb?

I'd forgotten all about him until your reminder, so just checked PITO web site to see that he's still there, and yes, he is! Mr Webb made a rapid exit from DERA at the time it was being privatized, presumably because his chances of survival within a commercial organizationas the Director of IT were pretty slim. This predictable exit is remembered well by those of us who used to work in the IT/IS departments, and it seems that PITO was an ideal choice for his skillset. The use of 0870 after the London bombings should have led to his demise, but this is the civil service we are talking about. Fall on your sword? Fat chance!

having worked at PITO as a contractor, not an employee, i want you to know a couple of things.

PITO is closing down on 31 March 2007 and being replaced by NPIA.
Phillip Webb is leaving at the end of PITO.
PITO make no money from the police forces 0870 numbers! they are not allowed to make money!

ask me any question about pito and i will try and help.  i worked there for 3 years.

cheers.

getagrip wrote on Feb 14^th, 2007 at 10:29pm:

PITO make no money from the police forces 0870 numbers! they are not allowed to make money! ask me any question about pito and i will try and help.  i worked there for 3 years

No PITO don't make the money but surely the individual police forces they recommend to mainly use 0845 numbers for their main contact centres do make money or more likely their telecoms provider offers a cheaper switchboard and a lower annual contract price than would be the case if an 01/02 geographic number was used.  So the Police force are getting the benefit of the hidden revenue share but not as a direct visible cash transfer.

Following the debacle over the collapse of the 101 Single Non Emergency Number (surely doomed by charging callers to call it while calls to 112/999 remained free) what plans did PITO appear to have to recommend Police forces to migrate from 0845 numbers to the new 0345 numbers charged at 01/02 prices?  Or didn't they care as they were being wiped out.

I assume that the wonderful Mr Webb who idb did not enjoy working with in his earlier career is now taking early retirement with a nice fat pay off?  So laughing all the way to the bank sadly like the 084  and 087 ripoff merchhants he so greatly assisted. :o >:( :'(

They must get a reduction in charges (which is equivalent to income) OR whoever negotiated the deal should be fired for the huge waste of tax payers money that could have been saved by generating an income stream lie any other 0870 number does.

I have asked a GLA member and an MP to look into this particular incident. No response so far.

ask ACPO about the 0845 numbers used for the main numbers...

just one thing 'my thought only' if they used 0800 instead of 0870/0845 would people complain that pito were wasting tax payers money?  (just a thought)

Keith wrote on Feb 14^th, 2007 at 10:53pm:

They must get a reduction in charges (which is equivalent to income) OR whoever negotiated the deal should be fired for the huge waste of tax payers money that could have been saved by generating an income stream lie any other 0870 number does. I have asked a GLA member and an MP to look into this particular incident. No response so far.

 you have to remember at the time (it takes government ages to do anything) that 0870 was acceptable to use.  PITO projects take a long time to carry out.

**just my view***

getagrip wrote on Feb 14^th, 2007 at 11:02pm:

ask ACPO about the 0845 numbers used for the main numbers... just one thing 'my thought only' if they used 0800 instead of 0870/0845 would people complain that pito were wasting tax payers money?  (just a thought)

Well one of their objectives with the non emergency number is to get people to stop clogging up 999/112 so it seems like a good idea to use 0800 on the face of it.  However due to the premium rate charged for 0800 from mobile phones a geographic 01/02 number would also be needed.

Overall its a number charged at geographic rates that we think is fair.  All these 0845s should be converted to the new Ofcom 03 geographic priced range and the Police could negotiate a suitable fee for the value of the call routing features in place.  The cost of calls to 0845 from a BT Payphone and a mobile phone are scandalously high.

getagrip wrote on Feb 14^th, 2007 at 11:04pm:

you have to remember at the time (it takes government ages to do anything) that 0870 was acceptable to use.  PITO projects take a long time to carry out.

No it was never acceptable.

To anyone who understood how the UK phone network operated 0870 was a ripoff that cost more than non 084/7 numbers from the moment they were launched in 1997 or 1997.

These numbers have been the subject of a massive confidence trick by the European telecoms mafia.  Fixed line calls fall so they turn ordinary fixed line calls into covert premium rate calls.....

getagrip wrote on Feb 14^th, 2007 at 10:29pm:

having worked at PITO as a contractor, not an employee, i want you to know a couple of things. PITO is closing down on 31 March 2007 and being replaced by NPIA. Phillip Webb is leaving at the end of PITO. PITO make no money from the police forces 0870 numbers! they are not allowed to make money! ask me any question about pito and i will try and help.  i worked there for 3 years. cheers.

Just one question - why is this body so inept?

idb wrote on Feb 17^th, 2007 at 3:34pm:

Just one question - why is this body so inept?

Perhaps because it has been run by your old much disliked and complacent colleague Philip Webb? ;)

getagrip wrote on Feb 14^th, 2007 at 11:04pm:

Keith wrote on Feb 14th, 2007 at 10:53pm: They must get a reduction in charges (which is equivalent to income) OR whoever negotiated the deal should be fired for the huge waste of tax payers money that could have been saved by generating an income stream lie any other 0870 number does. I have asked a GLA member and an MP to look into this particular incident. No response so far.  you have to remember at the time (it takes government ages to do anything) that 0870 was acceptable to use.  PITO projects take a long time to carry out. **just my view***

What is acceptable and what is appropriate are two entirely different concepts seemingly overlooked by PITO. This organization is supposed to be technically competent and is supposed to have an understanding of telecommunication issues ito police and emergency service at a level greater than the average citizen. Now, on July 7, a couple of years back, after a major incident, and one where there is a reasonable expectation that international inbound calls would follow such an incident, the hopeless and hapless PITO issues a telephone number that firstly cannot be dialled consistently from overseas, and secondly is charged at a premium for various UK callers. Now, I am not a telecommunication expert, however I am aware of the difficulties using NGNs where international access is required and expected. PITO *is* the so-called expert, yet it fails to use sufficient foresight to get this right on the day, despite it actually being advised, as far as I can tell, by C&W of the potential problems. PITO focussed only on the cost. It is this dammning indictment that should have led to Webb and others responsible to get the heave-ho but of course no sanctions happened, leading PITO to generate yet more stupidity later on by the introduction of 101 and the further use of NGNs by police forces. As I said, PITO is supposed to understand and deal with these issues. It doesn't. Much like Ofcom and ICSTIS, it is a wholly inappropriate body when it comes to providing telecommunication services fit for a first-world economy and for the average UK citizen-consumer.

Yet the incompetents responsible like Webb draw huge salaries and clear off with large pensions. ::) >:( :'(

now that PITO is no more has anyone thought of doing an FoI on the National Policing Improvement Agency that took over from it to see if it is operating any 0871, 0870, 0845 or 0844 numbers?

just interested. ;)

hubba wrote on Jul 29^th, 2007 at 9:32pm:

now that PITO is no more has anyone thought of doing an FoI on the National Policing Improvement Agency that took over from it to see if it is operating any 0871, 0870, 0845 or 0844 numbers? just interested. ;)

I was unaware they had even be created.

I suppose an FOI to ask about their intentions in relation to the new 03 number range, given that any development of 101 has been out on hold, might be productive.

http://www.npia.police.uk

when does the 030 number come in to use?

hubba wrote on Jul 29^th, 2007 at 9:44pm:

when does the 030 number come in to use?

I think you perhaps mean 0300?

That is a question I think you really need to raise with Ofcom as it is something we would all dearly like to have the answer to but so far they have been keeping us in the dark.

hubba wrote on Jul 29^th, 2007 at 9:44pm:

http://www.npia.police.uk when does the 030 number come in to use?

Looks like the NPIA is not averse to using 0845/0870:

http://www.npia.police.uk/en/6973.htm

Contact Us
To ensure a prompt reply please direct your enquiry to the appropriate department:

Solihull  0845 015 1216

Specialist Operations Centre
Email: soc@npia.pnn.police.uk
Telephone: +44 (0) 870 241 5641  (I despair at the +44 bit used in conjunction with 870)


Surveillance
Email: surveillance.surveillance@npia.pnn.police.uk
Telephone: +44 (0) 870 241 5641