Hi,

I have just recently found your site and as my phone package includes free UK calls (excluding 0845/0875) I am saving money, thanks.

I phoned my tax office today using the geographical number listed on the main database and after taking me through my security, the tax rep said I had used a number intended for people phoning from outside the UK, that I was lucky to get through to the right tax office and I should have used the 0845 number. I explained that I pay for 0845 numbers and could she give me another geographical number, but she said that the 0845 number was the only one to use when phoning from the UK. She was very polite and did not have a ‘jobs worth’ attitude and she did answer my tax query.

Is this a normal response that I should just ignore? I also don’t know how I could have got through to the wrong office as the area code was the right one for the tax office location.  :)

Others have suggested putting 141 in front of the number and pretend you are on holiday! However you have to be prepared if they want to call you back and you will have to come up with an excuse!!!!

sherbert wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2008 at 2:47pm:

Others have suggested putting 141 in front of the number and pretend you are on holiday! However you have to be prepared if they want to call you back and you will have to come up with an excuse!!!!

That would be were having an 0845/0870 number yourself for these people would come in handy, you could say it is transfer number, well they lie about their NGNs!

sherbert wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2008 at 2:47pm:

Others have suggested putting 141 in front of the number and pretend you are on holiday! However you have to be prepared if they want to call you back and you will have to come up with an excuse!!!!

generally speaking,you wont get rung back by many of these institutions.
anyway,why should you pay to ring them twice.
i just got my phone bill today and like you and a lot more people here,i have inclusive uk calls in my package.
there was £18.50 extra for phone calls on the bill.
being from ireland and living in the uk,i do ring ireland,but this was only approx£8.
i dont mind this,but the £10 charge annoyed me greatly.
i discovered some of the others living here are ringing these 0870 numbers.i have now shown them where i have this site bookmarked and warned them against ringing 0870s in future.
this is the only country in europe where this extortion goes on.
i cant understand why the government,who are big offenders themselves allow this rip off to continue.

Whilst I hate any use from our dear government in using these expensive numbers, I fear if they stopped using them they would find another way to make up the shortfall in revenue. A bit like telling the Great British Public to stop smoking and drinking, if they did they would be billions short in the exchequer ::)

greg wrote on Jul 9^th, 2008 at 1:39pm:

this is the only country in europe where this extortion goes on.

No it is not.

Ireland has a website called SayNoTo1890 against 0818, 1850 and 1890 prefixes. Website against Spanish 902s, Belguin site and Germany all have similar sites.

This issue has already been covered way back, and there is a fool-proof solution to this without phoning the numbers intended for use when abroad. You can actually get HMRC to telephone you back (thus at no cost to you) See http://www.saynoto0870.com/cgi-bin/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1175528146

dorf wrote on Jul 9^th, 2008 at 11:34pm:

there is a fool-proof solution to this

Unless those who are unaware of this technique or unwilling to use it are to be classified as "fools", it would be fairer to say that there is a workaround available, rather than a solution.

Even alternative direct geo numbers, which are very valuable and worthy of publication, are not a "solution" to the improper funding of public services by service users.

Yes have been trying to get an alternative to HMRC's 0845 306 1204 'Time to pay Helpline' number - no matter where you phone on the alternative Geographical nos - nobody can put you through. I's a joke! Would therefore be grateful if someone has managed to obtain the real number behind the above 0845 one.

Bear in mind that if you have a BT landline there is no charge for an 0845 number depending on which option you are on

See here


http://bt.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/bt.cfg/php/enduser/cci/bt_adp.php?p_sid=GmSUH3rj&p_faqid=12732&cat_lvl1=345&cat_lvl2=350&cat_lvl3=361&p_cv=3.361&p_cats=345,350,361

sherbert wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2009 at 12:29pm:

Bear in mind that if you have a BT landline there is no charge for an 0845 number depending on which option you are on

Yes, people are being caught by that.

The exact T&Cs BT use are (the highlighted part in parenthesis is my addition):

Quote:

If you're on the Unlimited Weekend Plan (MOST PEOPLE), these calls will be free at the weekends, if you're on the Unlimited Evening and Weekend Plan, they're free evenings and weekends and if you're on the Unlimited Anytime Plan, they're free 24/7.

Is the free calls thing being misunderstood?

If you are on a BT residential line outside the "free" calls period, calls to 0845 numbers are cheaper than to geographic alternatives. For these callers we should perhaps be promoting 0845 numbers as alternatives to geographic numbers.

It is now only non-BT callers who now need geographic alternatives to 0845.

It was those calling within their BT packages who needed them until recently.

Heinz wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2009 at 2:33pm:

sherbert wrote on Feb 23rd, 2009 at 12:29pm: Bear in mind that if you have a BT landline there is no charge for an 0845 number depending on which option you are on Yes, people are being caught by that. The exact T&Cs BT use are (the highlighted part in parenthesis is my addition): Quote: If you're on the Unlimited Weekend Plan (MOST PEOPLE), these calls will be free at the weekends, if you're on the Unlimited Evening and Weekend Plan, they're free evenings and weekends and if you're on the Unlimited Anytime Plan, they're free 24/7.

There is this to take into account...

Fair Usage Policy

You can make 1000 minutes of calls a month, or 150 calls a month. This is considerably more than most customers are likely to ever make. If you exceed either of these limits you'll just be charged the standard BT rates until further notice.

sherbert wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2009 at 3:58pm:

There is this to take into account...

Inland Revenue may keep you on hold for a while and may not resolve your query at the first attempt, but are we seriously suggesting that a monthly limit of 1000 minutes and 150 calls is likely to be exceeded by someone sorting out their personal tax affairs on a residential line. That is up to £31.60 worth of daytime 0845 calls at standard rates for less than £5 extra.

It is unacceptable for HMRC to use revenue sharing numbers and BT is guilty of all manner of tricks, but less us remain proportionate and focussed on the real issues.

SilentCallsVictim wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2009 at 7:23pm:

sherbert wrote on Feb 23rd, 2009 at 3:58pm: are we seriously suggesting that a monthly limit of 1000 minutes and 150 calls is likely to be exceeded by someone sorting out their personal tax affairs on a residential line. That is up to £31.60 worth of daytime 0845 calls at standard rates for less than £5 extra.

Not at all. I was pointing out BT's Fair User's Policy, this is for ALL 0870 & 0845 numbers, not just the ones to the Inland revenue

SilentCallsVictim wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2009 at 2:44pm:

Is the free calls thing being misunderstood? If you are on a BT residential line outside the "free" calls period, calls to 0845 numbers are cheaper than to geographic alternatives. For these callers we should perhaps be promoting 0845 numbers as alternatives to geographic numbers. It is now only non-BT callers who now need geographic alternatives to 0845. It was those calling within their BT packages who needed them until recently.

It still costs less to use a dial through number,(1899, 18185 18866 etc), for ALL users on/not on "inclusive",(NOT free), minutes to call 01/02/03 numbers, ALL other providers,(including dial through charge per minute to call 084/087 numbers), but 01/02/03 are charged, typically, 5p per call, not per minute.
Not a lot of people are on BTs anytime,(which includes daytime calls), and HMRC and most government departments only have restricted hours for ones on weekend unlimited package.

Therefore I disagree that "For these callers we should perhaps be promoting 0845 numbers as alternatives to geographic numbers. "

derrick wrote on Feb 24^th, 2009 at 11:43am:

I disagree that "For these callers we should perhaps be promoting 0845 numbers as alternatives to geographic numbers. "

So do I, but for quite different reasons.

There are other websites (e.g. MSE) that promote discount companies to enable consumers to get a possibly better deal on various products and services. It is for them to promote dodgy telephone service providers and to highlight perverse features such as BT offering calls to 0845 numbers more cheaply than geographic numbers during weekdays for those NOT on packages at this time.

It is fair enough for us to discuss these matters in our forum, but I understand the focus of "SayNo" to be on opposition to use of revenue sharing numbers. One way in which it seeks to undermine use of revenue sharing numbers is by providing geographic alternatives. Those who use the alternatives may save money, if not time and effort. Those on BT without the anytime option help the cause but cost themselves money if they call geo, rather than 0845, numbers during the daytime - this did not change in January.

We must also remember that if HMRC were to lose its subsidy from revenue sharing then the hole in its budget would have to be filled somehow.

SilentCallsVictim wrote on Feb 24^th, 2009 at 12:30pm:

Those on BT without the anytime option help the cause but cost themselves money if they call geo, rather than 0845, numbers during the daytime - this did not change in January. We must also remember that if HMRC were to lose its subsidy from revenue sharing then the hole in its budget would have to be filled somehow.

Not if they use 1899,1866,18185 etc!

HMRC,(and ALL other gov depts), should be funded,as they where set up to do, via general taxation, NOT covert phone numbers!!!  "the hole in its budget would have to be filled somehow." This can be filled by stopping oversea/international aid etc, and that sort of thing can then be funded by people who want to do so via registered charities!
Anyway, they will tell you they do not receive finacial aid from said numbers!

I totally agree with the point that delivery of what I would term "public services" (that is not all departmental spending) should be funded by general taxation.

I thought that I had dealt with the issue of dodgy overseas telephone companies, that some say should not be supported because they are foreign, and was referring only to callers who used BT.

I fail to see any connection between HMRC using revenue sharing numbers and the DfID budget. The latter should be set appropriately, not made in any way conditional upon the former.

SilentCallsVictim wrote on Feb 24^th, 2009 at 4:38pm:

I totally agree with the point that delivery of what I would term "public services" (that is not all departmental spending) should be funded by general taxation.

Actually we have never been at all sure of your position ever since you first turned up in this discussion forum.  One minute you seem to be with us and the next minute you are saying you can fully see why the government's departments and agencies decided to use 084 and 087 numbers.  That is not the mindset of a true www.saynoto0870.com campaigner.  True campaigners oppose all use of these numbers root and branch and at no time do they ever accept or endorse the excuses of the opposition for introducing them or refusing to scrap them.


Quote:

I thought that I had dealt with the issue of dodgy overseas telephone companies, that some say should not be supported because they are foreign, and was referring only to callers who used BT.

Are you opposed to international commerce then?  Can I take it that you never ever buy and of the "dodgy" electrical goods, clothes or furniture made in China that now makes up the majority of stock in many UK high street stores.  The Finarea group are based in Switzerland (part of the European Economic Area) but actually carry out billing through a subsidiary (Connect Telecom) that is a UK limited company registered with Companies House.  So what exactly is dodgy about Finarea then?  As a past customer I found a great deal more that was dodgy about the UK based TalkTalk/CPW group and their extraordinarily inaccurate billing practices and appalling customer service.