I rang BT this week and asked them the price of making 0560 calls.

BT said it was the same as geographical calls and quoted 01 and 02 calls which they said are about 5p a minute.

I made the call at mid-day on Wednesday and it was shown on the bill as 43 seconds charged at 16p.

This is a bit steep isn't it?

James EB

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~ Edited by Dave: Thread title amended

JamesEB wrote on Aug 21^st, 2010 at 2:12am:

This is a bit steep isn't it?

Yes, BT charges for non-inclusive calls are indeed steep.

Because call plans feature inclusive calls during the selected period, it is assumed that customers will select a plan that covers the times when they use the telephone, so as to avoid incurring penalty charges. The cost of calls that would be included when made outside the period covered by the call plan are currently being increased at a steady rate of around 30% per annum.

These penalty charges, which now exceed the regulated premium rates charged for calls to revenue sharing 0844 numbers, should never be used for comparison purposes, as if they were a "standard" charge. The normal rate for a call to a geographic (or other inclusive) number from BT is 0p per minute.

This 30% annual rate of increase also applies to the call setup fee which is also incurred when calling numbers that are never inclusive.


Calls to 0560 numbers are indeed charged at the same rate as geographic calls and are treated as inclusive (i.e. with no call charge for the first hour) when a call plan is in effect.

The non-inclusive weekday daytime rate is 9.9p call setup fee + 5.9 pence per minute. Duration is rounded up to the nearest minute and the total cost to the nearest penny.

A 43-second (or indeed 1-second) call will cost 9.9p + 5.9p = 15.8p, rounded up to 16p.

One can see where the BT representative got the 5p from, but it was only part (less than a third) of the story. I would regard that as misleading information and a wholly inadequate response to the enquiry.

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The following is not a commercial for BT, but a statement of significant fact.

The upgrade to Unlimited Anytime (barring special offers) costs £4.99 per month = 25p per weekday.

Examples of the minimum weekday daytime calling pattern (to inclusive numbers) that would make this worthwhile include: 1 call per day of over 2 minutes, 2 calls per week of over 8 minutes, 10 calls per month of over 6 minutes. Once the justifying threshold has been crossed to give a small saving, all subsequent calls (to inclusive numbers) could be thought of as being free.

This is relevant to campaigning, in that it provides a justification for my claim that the standard BT charge for weekday daytime calls to geographic numbers is fairly given as 0p per minute. Only those who very rarely use their BT landline during the weekday daytime (which now extends to 7pm) would choose to incur the penalty charge on the exceptional occasions when they do so. This assertion is necessary to counter claims that calling 0844 numbers is cheaper at 9.9p + 5p minute, not to promote BT as a provider.

P.S. After the next price rise on 1 October, the one (or 43) second call will cost 10.9p + 6.4p per minute = 17.3p, rounded up to 18p. The lower thresholds of 3 calls per week of over 5 minutes, or 9 per month of over 6 minutes, would be sufficient to justify subscription to Unlimited Anytime.

5.9p is 'about 6p' and not 'about 5p' anyway.

Heinz wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2010 at 8:02pm:

5.9p is 'about 6p' and not 'about 5p' anyway.

0p, the standard BT charge, is not "about 5p".

16p, the penalty charge for the first minute of a call, is not "about 5p" either.

Nobody pays "about 6p". A 10-minute call, at 69p, is "about 7p" per minute. A 9-minute call, at 63p, is exactly 7p per minute. A 19-minute call, at £1.22, is the shortest that falls below 6.5p per minute. Only on a call of 1 hour 49 minutes, at £6.53, does the rate fall below 6p per minute. A 1 hour 23 minute call, at £5.00, costs more than the monthly subscription to Unlimited Anytime.

SilentCallsVictim wrote on Aug 21^st, 2010 at 4:18am:

JamesEB wrote on Aug 21st, 2010 at 2:12am: This is a bit steep isn't it? Yes, BT charges for non-inclusive calls are indeed steep. Because call plans feature inclusive calls during the selected period, it is assumed that customers will select a plan that covers the times when they use the telephone, so as to avoid incurring penalty charges. The cost of calls that would be included when made outside the period covered by the call plan are currently being increased at a steady rate of around 30% per annum. These penalty charges, which now exceed the regulated premium rates charged for calls to revenue sharing 0844 numbers, should never be used for comparison purposes, as if they were a "standard" charge. The normal rate for a call to a geographic (or other inclusive) number from BT is 0p per minute. This 30% annual rate of increase also applies to the call setup fee which is also incurred when calling numbers that are never inclusive. Calls to 0560 numbers are indeed charged at the same rate as geographic calls and are treated as inclusive (i.e. with no call charge for the first hour) when a call plan is in effect. The non-inclusive weekday daytime rate is 9.9p call setup fee + 5.9 pence per minute. Duration is rounded up to the nearest minute and the total cost to the nearest penny. A 43-second (or indeed 1-second) call will cost 9.9p + 5.9p = 15.8p, rounded up to 16p. One can see where the BT representative got the 5p from, but it was only part (less than a third) of the story. I would regard that as misleading information and a wholly inadequate response to the enquiry. The following is not a commercial for BT, but a statement of significant fact. The upgrade to Unlimited Anytime (barring special offers) costs £4.99 per month = 25p per weekday. Examples of the minimum weekday daytime calling pattern (to inclusive numbers) that would make this worthwhile include: 1 call per day of over 2 minutes, 2 calls per week of over 8 minutes, 10 calls per month of over 6 minutes. Once the justifying threshold has been crossed to give a small saving, all subsequent calls (to inclusive numbers) could be thought of as being free. This is relevant to campaigning, in that it provides a justification for my claim that the standard BT charge for weekday daytime calls to geographic numbers is fairly given as 0p per minute. Only those who very rarely use their BT landline during the weekday daytime (which now extends to 7pm) would choose to incur the penalty charge on the exceptional occasions when they do so. This assertion is necessary to counter claims that calling 0844 numbers is cheaper at 9.9p + 5p minute, not to promote BT as a provider. P.S. After the next price rise on 1 October, the one (or 43) second call will cost 10.9p + 6.4p per minute = 17.3p, rounded up to 18p. The lower thresholds of 3 calls per week of over 5 minutes, or 9 per month of over 6 minutes, would be sufficient to justify subscription to Unlimited Anytime.

Thanks SilentCallsVictim for a most helpful and informative reply.

It seems that BT also gave me misleading information on how not to incur the Caller Display charge but as a newbie I cannot see where to put that question on here as it must have been discussed before.

Thanks again.

JamesEB

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