Hi,

I'am a web tinkerer with over 10 years of tinkering experience and have had a play with creating a web app that will calculate expected call costs based on prefix, operator, time and call plan.

Does anyone think that this would be useful for me to spend a couple of weeks developing?

The basic brief is an accessible app/webpage that will have 3-4 steps and at the end tell you how much a call to say an 0344 number from Vodafone without/with bolt ons would cost using a sliding time scale.

I intend on using conditional logic to keep the form simple and using geographical number this would be a doddle- however I get the feeling that some of the 08/09 numbers may need additional logic to account for service charges?

I am happy to do the math, design, tech and build etc.- but may need help with collecting data on operator costs for each prefix.

Anyhow- just an idea that may help people understand call costs and possibly give suggestions on moving call plan if needed.

Thoughts, suggestions or ideas for improvement/functionality please?

I have a prototype nearly ready, would it be OK to place a link to it here?

Hi there Tony,

Can I clarify exactly what this App/Webpage would do?

So would you type in a number select a network you would call from and it will tell you how much per minute or per call it will cost?

How will this be updated to reflect changes to call costs?

It sounds like a great App, but it would be interesting to find out how you intend to get it working..

Hi,

At the moment I have built one specifically for 0345 numbers, at the backend I have added price per minute for  major UK networks, for each selectable scenario. PAYG, PAYG+ BOLT ON, PAYM with inclusive mins, PAYM used/without inclusive mins.

Based on the selection above the call cost is calculated.. OPTION X Time= call cost.

I want to develop this into something that will cover more number ranges, but will probably need help with data input/gather.

As far as changing prices, I am building a simple bot to search Google, pull prices, validate and update in realtime. ( may be a few weeks off though as I am quite busy with work)

tony8 wrote on Sep 7^th, 2015 at 5:59pm:

At the moment I have built one specifically for 0345 numbers

Why 0345 numbers? They are charged at the same rate as 01 (excluding IOM and Channel Islands), 02 and all other 03 numbers, by all networks.

Hi Kasg,

The reasoning behind choosing 0345 is two-fold.


1) I have chosen the 0345 prefix specifically because it is less complex than other prefixes ( no service, connection charges)

This means that the math behind the app ( actually a webpage that behaves like an app)  to be as simple as OUT OF PLAN per minute call X length of call

Networks do differ in the PPM charge to 01, 02 and 03 calls when no bolt-on or inclusive minutes are available.

This is reflected in what I have already put together

'If' i can can make an 0345 app useful then I would like to look toward creating one that includes a wider range of prefixes/options including service charges, connection charges, netwroks and plans that is navigated conditionally fore ease of use.

2) I have put together a site offering information on 0345 numbers and an app seemed like a good addition to that site.

I'll send you  a PM with a link to what I have already tinkered with so you can have a play.

Oh, and thanks you for reminding me about the IOM and CI exclusions - I will add these to the formula later this evening after work.

Ian01 had mentioned this, along with explaining how complex a 'catch all' formula may end up being.

Hi Tony,

It seems that you have a few misunderstandings.


tony8 wrote on Sep 8^th, 2015 at 9:34am:

1) I have chosen the 0345 prefix specifically because it is less complex than other prefixes ( no service, connection charges)

That is not true, 0345 does have connection charges, it is 08 and 09 numbers that now do not. Also, 0345 is no different to any other 03 number.


tony8 wrote on Sep 8^th, 2015 at 9:34am:

Networks do differ in the PPM charge to 01, 02 and 03 calls when no bolt-on or inclusive minutes are available.

They don't, they can't.

I do seem to be getting that wrapped around my neck agan- and I thought the 0345 was a simple choice?.

Both me and my wife are on Vodafone, I have unlimited calls she does not, I do not pay anything extra for calling 0345 numbers, she pays 45p per minute.

https://www.vodafone.co.uk/explore/costs/call-charges/


"tony8 wrote Today at 10:34am:

Networks do differ in the PPM charge to 01, 02 and 03 calls when no bolt-on or inclusive minutes are available.


They don't, they can't."

It does appear that networks charge differing rates on out of bundle calls to 01 ,02 and 03 numbers based on the following page

http://smartcaller.org/prefixes/0345-numbers/

Are you saying that all calls to 0345 have a set price that networks muct charge ? ( again asuming out of plan/ minutes)

tony8 wrote on Sep 8^th, 2015 at 10:13am:

Are you saying that all calls to 0345 have a set price that networks muct charge ? ( again asuming out of plan/ minutes)

No, not at all, but I can see that what I wrote might have been interpreted that way. I was simply saying that all networks have to treat 01, 02 and 03 numbers the same way and charge the same for each, although each network is free to charge whatever it likes.

tony8 wrote on Sep 8^th, 2015 at 10:13am:

Both me and my wife are on Vodafone, I have unlimited calls she does not, I do not pay anything extra for calling 0345 numbers, she pays 45p per minute.

Exactly the same as she would have been charged to call a geographic number.

Yes. ;D

That is not the distinction that I am making. - I understand that 01/02/03 numbers are treated the same.

What I want to get accross is that calls to 0345 numbers in (my case specifically to the HMRC ) may be charged differently accross networks and plans.

I want to be able to show the difference that an inclusive call from X network would cost compared no a non inclusive call from the same or another network.

tony8 wrote on Sep 8^th, 2015 at 10:40am:

What I want to get accross is that calls to 0345 numbers in (my case specifically to the HMRC ) may be charged differently accross networks and plans.

But that's the same as any other number (except 080) so I still don't get it. Who is claiming that they should all cost the same?

tony8 wrote on Sep 8^th, 2015 at 9:34am:

Networks do differ in the PPM charge to 01, 02 and 03 calls when no bolt-on or inclusive minutes are available.

They don't, they can't.
[/quote]

You seem to be? -- *edit* I see now, your reading the above as me saying that calls to 01 may differ from calls to 02.. this is not what I'm saying.. more that calls to these ranges ( inclusive of 01/2/3) differ accross networks.

But aside from that it is general confusion/ignorance from people who are not 'hot' on the whole numbering thing who are needing it pointing out.

The site I run sees thousands of S/E queries each day indicating confusion over costs of calls to 0345 numbers, a large percentage asking if these calls are "free" when on an inclusive contract or not, as such this is where I am focussing.

If the idea is to compare, why not have a table where each network has one row and the table has five columns, headed: network/tariff, pay monthly with allowance, pay monthly allowance exceeded, pay as you go with add on or bundle, pay as you go without add on or bundle?

Connection fees apply for calls to 01, 02 and 03 numbers, but only on non-inclusive calls made from landlines. So far, the app lists only mobile networks.

A table of call costs should make clear that it applies to all geographic 01 and 02 numbers (except 01534 Jersey, 01481 Guernsey and 01624 Isle of Man) and non-geographic 03 numbers. Singling out 0345 may lead to confusion.

The exceptional pricing for Jersey, Guernsey and Isle of Man applies only on calls to geographic 01 numbers and mobile 071-075 and 077-079 numbers. It does not apply to non-geographic numbers starting 03, 08 or 09.

Hi Ian01,

A table is exactly what I initially produced, however with 72% of searches coming from mobile devices I am looking for a more user friendly option in terms of space on screen/readbility.

I do like the idea of calculating the prospective cost over a given duration for the user hence a math driven thingy.

Given that the initial test build is hosted on a site specifically about 0345 numbers ( and reaches people looking into this number only) I'm hoping that confusion re other 03 prefixes will not be an issue whilst I test.

I have held off with landlines so that I can check my facts, but will add these along with the connection fee once I've nailed the mobile networks.

In the future I want to be able to cover a larger number of networks and prefixes, and these will only need to be added to the present rather than needing a new build - and the final app/calculator will be hosted on a totally seperate domain with nothing but the app and a bot updating it.