This FOI response was verging on the side of rudeness and arrogance. The Typos are mine, typing this at speed.




why do you use 0870..


What are the eqiv geo numbers. 

Revenue


Aware of rev collected by provider:

Considered COI guidelines:
What Conclusions:


Do you reliase that all calls (national/local 01/02) cost the same:


Are you aware how much callers pay:
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Why use 0845:

What equiv geo numbers:

what revenue from use of 0845:

aware of revenue to telco op:

Do you reliase that all calls (national/local 01/02) cost the same regardless if calling from London or Glasgow: 

DO you realise that 0845 numbers now offer no cost advantage to callers, irrespective of their locations, only disadvantages? 


Jon Carter
Business Manager, Transiton and Sponsorship
Direct Dial: 0870 336 6042

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Thats it for the questions he actually answered, nice to see he changed his tune from saying that 01/02 calls do cost different amounts in the begining to saying they cost the same.

Any advice on how to proceed as I do belive that he has failed to answer the questions.

So any advice?

hi had the response, I will post the full letter up tonight when ive got more time.

basicly the geo number is 020 7713 2700 (0870 336 6000)

...

3.
The revenue that the RPC has received to date from 0870 calls is approximately £800 but would reiterate the point that the 0870 numbers are primarily intended for calls from businesses and other stakeholders whereas the publicly advertised number for calls from members of the public is a local-rate 0845 number from which we make no revenue.

4.
BT

In terms of further information that you ask for, it is dificult to know what to provide - as I have outlined above, we sought and obtained guidance from both the COI and OfCOM in relation to the use of 0870 numbers and having reviewed our invitation to tender and the subsequent submissions from the companies that tendered to provide our telephone services, the COI was of the view that the service being provided by BT did not contradict its guidelines as we have various alternative methods of contact available, including a local-rate number, web and email channels. Clearly the content of the submissions from the companies who responded to our invitation to tender is commercially confidential but I have included below an extract from the RPC’s own working group (which had a COI representative on it) minutes where the decision to go with 0870 numbers was debated:

The group discussed the implication of all staff having 0870 numbers as direct dials, which is required because of the way the new internal network is structured with the ‘hub’ as the London office and agreed that this was preferable to staff in offices in Scotland, Wales or the English regions having 020 London prefix numbers. Chair of the working group, Tim Nicholson, said that he didn’t think this was a problem and would in fact make the numbers more portable in the event of office moves or future changes. The group discussed the issues surrounding choosing 0870 (e.g. national rate) numbers and it was agreed that, while the passenger contact centre needed to have an 0845 number to enable members of the public to ring in at local rate charges, it was appropriate for the offices to have national rate 0870 numbers as these would primarily be used to channel calls from businesses and stakeholders, not members of the public.

Passenger Voices steering group minutes, 5 August 2004

I trust that my responses to your points clarifies the RPC’s position on the use of 0870 / 0845 numbers, but if you require any further information, please do not hesitate to contact me.
>>

Who responded to your FOI request? And was that the first response or a follow-up response?

It looks rather like Jon Carters been banned from responding to FOI requests.

hmm a lot better then my first response from him.

My Response (4 pages, FULL of text) was from Caroline Jones the Communications Director, oh and she put a 0870 at the bottom of the letter as well.
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Most of the response was virtually word for word with yours, other slight things were different, maybe beacuse of the snotty letter I sent back in response to Mr Carters "This is a matter of opinion and I am not required to debate the subject with you.".

Some of the stuff below has been slightly cut down so isnt word for word except in response to questions. Typos and grammer is my fault. Typing this at 01:45!!!!
9 AUG 2005

Thank you for your follow-up request under the FOI  on 14th July which as per your request, has been passed to me to investigate as a matter of best practice. I have reviewed your original correspondance and satisfied that Mr Carter responded to as many of your questions as he was able to.

cont..

Pg 2...

the old network just for the two offices in Manchester and London. With this information in mind, I will respond to your follow-up questions or comments in turn.

1.1- we did not advertise the old regional telephone numbers alongside the 0845 number as one of the benefits of introducing our new telephone system was the ability to accurately monitor call volumes to the RPC. This enabled us to better ensure that the range of advice and services we provide were adequately tailored to consumers needs and also so that we could ensure sufficient resourcing to deal with incoming telepjone contacts and other correspondence. For this reason, when the 0845 system was set up, we arranged with BT an automatic redirect from all the previous regional numbers to the 0845 number so that we could ensure we were capturing all contacts. This redirect was set up for a period of six months (sept 04-March 05), after which callers using hte old numbers recived a message redirecting them to the 0845 number, which I belive is common practice when changing telephone numbers. Therefore there was no point in publishing the old numbers as people would only recive a redirect message and this would undermine our ability to properly monitor call volumes by bypassing this system.

1.2 - as all the regional offices have now closed, there is nobody in any of these locations to recive telephone calls so I cannot see the need to release numbers that a)do not go anywhere and b) are in the process of being released back ot the original provider. I am however happy to provide an alternative number which is one that we have made available to those wishing to call from overseas. This is 020 7713 2700. However, this number is only manned dureing usual working hours (9am-5pm Mon to Fri) unlike our 0845 number which is available 8am-8pm Mon to Fri and 8am-4pm at weekends and bank holidays.

1.4 and 2.3 I note that Mr Carter has provided you with a breakdown of the revenue that the RPC receives from 0870 calls and would reiterate again the point that the 0870 numbers are primarily intended for calls from Businesses and other stakeholders wheras the publicly advertised number for calls from members of the public is a local-rate 0845 number from which we make no revenue. However, I do not belive that there is any need for the RPC to contact BT to enquire as to the revenue it may collect from callers for providing us with this system. This is a matter for BT and a seperate FOI request to them directly if you wish to pursue it further.

1.5, 2.4 and 2.4.1 - As I have outlined above we sought and obtained guidance from both the COI and OfCOM in relation to the use of 0870 numbers and having reviewed our invitation to tender and the subsequent submissions from the companies that tendered to provide our telephone services, the COI was of the view that the service being provided by BT did not contradict its guidelines as we have various alternative nethods of contact available, including a local-rate number, web and email chanels. Clearly the content of the submission from the companies who responded to our invitation to tender is commercially confidential but I have included below an extract from the RPC's own working group (which has a COI rep on it) minutes where the decision to go with 0870 numbers was debated.

...

pg 4 of 4...

with a longer waiting time, and therfore higher call cost, then if we manage the system properly through the 0845 route.

2.6 - I am not sure if you are referring to 0845 or 0870 numbers in this point. If it is 0845, then we belieeve that the use of 0845 numbers does offer benefit to the majority of callers as it is a local rate service rather then the national rate service which would apply for people calling from most locations in Great Britain and the comparative call rates for daytime calls (when we experience the majority of calls) is 3.36 pence per minute rather then 6.73pence. However, we are aware of the potential disadvantages experenced by those who are on non-BT tariffs or who have packages with 'free minutes' or special deals and we will keep this matter under review.

I trust that my responses to your points clarifies the RPC's postion on the use of 0870 numbers.

Yours .....blah blah
Caroline Jones
Communications Director
0870 336 6020 [what a surprise]
caroline.jones@railpassengers.org.uk