Slightly off-topic perhaps, but when the UKPS replied to me last year about the inability to call its offices from overseas, it pointed out that British citizens who are overseas should contact the embassy/high commission. Accepting that this may be a legitimate point for one moment, I now note that the FCO has decided that my nearest embassy, in Washington, should use premium numbers (1-900) for passport queries:

http://www.britainusa.com/sections/articles_show_nt1.asp?d=3&i=104&L1=41003&L2=1...

"Passport services for British Citizens are centralised in Washington DC. Please visit the passport and citizenship pages by clicking here.

All passport telephone inquiries are handled by our outsource partner ABTRAN. Please call 1-900 285 7277. Hours of operation: Weekdays from 08.30-20.30 Eastern Standard Time. Calls cost $2.10 per minute. If you have difficulties reaching the above number and wish to pay by credit card, please call 1-800 630 3332."

For those that may be unaware, 1-900 numbers are often used for sex lines and other adult services. They are also used, less commonly, for pay-per-use helplines - often computer or technology-related. The numbers have a bad reputation and many people here know not to call them.

So if I have to make a query about my passport, I can't call the UKPS in the UK, and I am not prepared to call a premium rate number in the United States.

The use of premium rate numbers for passport/visa enquiries is now very common throughout the world. Many countries are adopting this approach. You even have to dial a premium rate number just to book an appointment to apply for a visa in many cases!!

I think it's mainly to do with the increase in youth travel around the globe. I had a Turkish girlfriend; and if she wanted to come with me to Italy say, she had to queue outside the Italian consulate from 6:30am in the morning for at least 4 hours! The rest of the queue was mainly students etc....

If you are a business person; or rich tourist, then you simply get a visa bureau to do the whole thing for you. They have special arrangements with the Embassies.

So I think the premium rate numbers are to keep the students with their endless questions and basic queries at bay. It's to force people to read the website; where you will find 99% of the answers to any queries.

The problem is compounded by the Schengen visa scheme in Europe. Any EU countries can issue one - and it allows travel throughout Europe. So if say one EU country makes it easy, quick and cheap to obtain such a visa from it's consulates/embassies; then they would find that everybody would be going to them for the visa - even though they may never actually visit that country that issued it.

I know that - because she used to do just that!

So I think it's a terrible advert for GB that they have a premium rate line - but that's what happens when the government try to run things - or privatize services with no competition.

But at least they're up-front about it. It's the 0870/45 scam I hate.

Yes I think you are correct PeDaSp, at least a 09 number is honest and straightforward. I am not sure though that it is justified when the cost of passports and visas has increased so much.

For helplines perhaps it is justified since there seem to be an increasing number of time wasters who will otherwise telephone with the most fatuous of queries; but as the only available means to apply for a passport or visa, or to make an appointment to obtain one from your own or a supposedly friendly country (like the USA) - I do not find the use of overt or covert Premium numbers to be acceptable.

My own boundary of acceptability for any concept of a Premium number (whether overt or covert) is whether a true value added service is provided. Therefore to call to make a purchase involves no value added service, since you will be paying for what you purchase and the price should include all incurred overheads as it used to. I believe that you are calling to purchase a passport for example (since you will be paying for it).

If you require a visa from a country in which you do not have any rights or which does not have any special relationship with your own country then you have to accept their terms, and if they decide to use an overt Premium number that is  their choice and you must accept it. However, if a British person wishes to apply for a visa to enter the USA (e.g. they do not have one of the latest form passports) I do not find it acceptable for them to have to call the US embassy on a Premium number to make an appointment, because of the supposed "special relationship" and the fact that US citizens do not need a visa to enter the EU.

As a matter of interest I had a lifetime BI/BII US visa and US Congress just decided to cancel it on arrival several years ago without notice, and did not refund the money I had paid for it! I was and am still very annoyed.

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Dorf,

The difficulty is that one man's timewaster is another man's asylum seeker........

But taking your point about deterrent effect etc I don't think charging more than about 25p per minute could possibly ever be acceptable and that would have to be on a line where the clock only started running at the moment you started talking to a real live person.

Naughty Mr NGM   

I've never said  that their "won't be a way to charge for receiving voice calls..." Nor that "no one will be able to charge for any individual voice calls".

Please show me where I've said that!

I think my posts must be too long and tedious and you are not wasting enough time reading them carefully....   

My argument with regards to VoIP/0870/Premium Numbers is that at present most folks don't realize that calling an 0870 number is more expensive then a normal geographic call. This is a scam.

But folks know when they are calling a premium rate number and the cost. They may not like it; and it may not be appropriate - but it's not my idea of a "scam". There is a difference between something being plain "wrong" and a scam. (Although scams are always wrong).

So when VoIP starts to come online big time - and SOME companies and SOME gov depts start to issue VoIP contact numbers; then the consumer/taxpayer will start to question why they can't call say A&L or the DVLA on a VoIP number. ie: not have to call a 0870/45 number which the consumer thinks (and those who have them) think/say are just like calling a normal number.

Corps and the gov have a desire (some of them at least) to be seen to be "with it" so to speak. Who would have thought even 10 years ago that every gov dept would now have it's own web site? And that every civil servant has their own email address?

Soon they will start to feel the same pressure from VoIP. People will start to think - how come I can call BP on a VoIP number but not the DTI? Just as they was a time when BP had a website but the DTI did not.

All this will flush-out the scams (hopefully).

I am quite sure that premium rate calling with always be with us - even if we come to live in a totally VoIP world. I'm sure that as time goes on a way will be found to charge for premium calls directly via VoIP and not through break-out into the PSTN.

These are the telephone numbers of consular departments, whose duties include issuing passports, of some countries nearest to me. Note that the only one that uses PRS is the British Embassy in Washington. All others use standard geographic numbers. I believe the situation at other British embassies/high commissions is generally to use 'normal' numbering. The use of PRS for the United States is just wrong.

Jamaica
Tel: (876) 510 0700
Fax: (876) 511 5335

Bahamas (refers to Jamaica)

Cuba
Tel: (537) 204 1771/ 72
Fax: (537) 204 8104

Canada
Telephone: 1 613 237 1303
Fax: 1 613 237 6537

Mexico:
Tel: (+52) (55) 5242-8500
Fax: (+52) (55) 5242-8523

USA:
Tel: (900) 285 7277

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I don't think they would refuse to handle the call, it's just that it would not be able to help me unless I was physically present, or likely to be present in Canada, which is fair enough.

It seems the 900 number was only introduced in April 2005. Presumably the FCO has been sold this idea as a money spinner, just like its 0870 travel number in the UK.

To me, it demonstrates exactly what the my own government thinks of me and the millions of other visitors and residents who come here each year that may need consular services.

Once I have qualified for a US passport, which won't be long now, I will simply refuse to renew my British one. They can stuff the passport wherever they desire. As far as I know, there is no requirement for a British citizen to enter the UK using a British passport.

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I do hope that you will not be cutting of your nose to spite your face over this one, even though I of course understanding your feelings regarding the behaviour of the British Embassy.

You don't need a UK passport as a British citizen not currently holding a valid uk passport but you will have to queue at Heathrow with those from other remote parts of the world, many of whom are deemed potential illegal immingrants.  You will also lose the right to reside indefinitely in any part of the European Union without the valid UK passport.  I note that you don't say you will be renouncing your nationality though so presumably you are just protesting at the excessive charges and unhelpfulness?

Wouldn't it be more effective though to write to the British Ambassador and to the Foreign Secretary and to the New York Times and the Washington Post?  If you don't like the reply from the Foreign Office then why not take the issue to the Ombudsman.

Also make sure to keep emailing the MPs signing the current early day motion and the various interested national newspaper journalists with the information.  I'm sure somebody would love to interview you for the File on Four program on BBC Radio 4 or something similar.  Perhaps you could get journalists to take your picture if you come to the uk and have to queue as a foreign national due to the excessive passport fees and costs.