Ofcom's con doc, paragraph A14.5 states:

Because of the conflicting nature of the results of the research, it is difficult to
determine the actual percentage of SPs that might migrate. However based on
the views expressed, Ofcom considers that it is most likely that between 35% and
45% of SPs (likely to account for approximately 45-55% of traffic⁴¹) might migrate
if 0870 numbers were linked back to geographic rates. Ofcom has therefore used
these figures to estimate the costs and benefits of restoring the geographic link
on this range.

⁴¹ All assumed to be voice traffic as ISPs do not tend to operate on the 0870 number range.

So, Ofcom's own view is that possibly 55% of all 0870 traffic will shift to a different revenue-generating range (I'm guessing 0844 due to the problems associated with a PRS-regulated 0871).

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Paragraph 2.22 says (as previous post) that 74 responses were from consumers and consumer organisations and that 26 were from communication providers (CPs; telcos to you and me), service providers (SPs; companies/organisations operating on 0845/0870 type numbers) and other regulatory bodies. Where "over 100" comes from, I don't know, because my maths tells me 74 + 26 = 100

Edit: Section 3 starts of by listing the numbers of each sort of respondant:
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So 1 more has been 'found'.

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What concerns me is that alot of Ofcom's idea of competition is that companies will simply move to another number range. That means changing number!

So they go out and get themselves a number that won't change if they move location and then they have to change it to stay ahead of the 'competition'! ???

As to taking effective action well it has come to me in a blinding flash of light that seems so simple but I doubt can be achieved in practice.

Basically Ofcom could be inundated with tens of thousands of responses to this consultation if we could encourage the management of TalkTalk, Tele2, Tiscali and Onetel (least likely in its current caretaker form awaiting sale) to write to their customers or email them telling them to respond to Ofcom's consultation complaining  that their all inclusive calling plans and/or cheap 1 hour evening/weekend call rates withe the companies are being heavily devalued by:-

(a) ongoing ripoff of 0870 being classed as premium rate not charged at same prices as geographic calls and no certainty that current Ofcom proposals will end this scam even on all 0870 numbers for all telecoms providers.  Most importantly that this makes the numbers excluded from their fixed price monthly calling plans.

(b) ongoing even bigger ripoff of 0845 numbers marketed as "Lo-Call" and cheaper than national rate geographic calls being now charged at a premium rate and so excluded from all inclusive 01/02 plans and charged at far more off peak for Level 1 customers/

(c) Further outrageous ripoff of 0844 numbers which most customers have been led to believe are "Local Rate" (not least by Mr Howard Stoate MP following the extensive 0870 adverse publicity for NEG and doctors surgeries) but are not and excluded from calling allowances.

(d) A general complaint that although these 084/7 numbers have now replaced normal 01/02 numbers for 90%+ of uk customer service calls that Ofcom has taken several years to make any proposals about the problem and now proposes to delay acting against any of these ripoffs (even 0871) for a further 18 months to 3 years depending on how you do your maths and consider when Ofcom's clock may start running.

One would hope TalkTalk, Tele2 etc would be all for this but I have a nasty feeling they won't want to publicise these calls currently being excluded from their normal calling plan prices?  Unfortunately Finarea is the only one with everything to gain from exposing the current ripoff but they don't have nearly as many customers and don't seem very aggressive about either their marketing or advertising.

And here is my own emailed reply back to Matt Peacock and Ofcom:-

-----Original Message-----
From: NGM
Sent: 30 September 2005 09:31
To: Matt Peacock

Subject: Ofcom's Explanation as to Why it Missed its Own Spring 2005 084/7 Action Deadline

Dear Matt,

Thank you for your email attempting to justify why your own promised deadline (given on BBC Radio 4's You & Yours program last November) for action by Ofcom on its last 084/7 consultation in Spring 2005 has not now been hit.

However it was always to be expected that respondents would not like Ofcom's Option 2 increased price granularity on 084/7 approach (that is even more price levels on 084/7 than now so no customer would then have a clue what they were paying for calling any 084 or 087 number) and that Ofcom's strange attempt to prejudge the outcome of its last consultation by saying that it much preferred its own Option 2 proposal would then be scuppered by the public's views.

And the sum total of responses you received from consumers to your last 084/7consultation pointed to them wanting something much closer to Ofcom's own Option 4 (abolish all revenue sharing on 084 and 087 numbers and turn them back into normal priced calls like 01/02 numbers), so why not get on and implement that solution in Spring 2005 or soon thereafter?

The answer seems to be that this did not suit the business interests of the telecoms industry partners who you appear to see as your customers for some reason, compared to the citizens and consumers given to you as being your customers in the remit that Parliament gave you.

And because you do not wish to upset those important powerful business customers and their senior staff and directors (many of whom just happen to be former working colleagues of current senior Ofcom staff) you have now decided to give them a further chance to water down and most importantly extensively delay what the public and the Ofcom Consumer Panel clearly wanted in their response to your last consultation.  And all the while these business 084/7 operators (especially on the Telco side) reap further massive profits from consumers who don't think that they should be paying any extra for these calls in the first place.

And whatever happens those hundreds of millions of pounds a year of unfair extra windfall call cost profits to the telcos (BT, Cable & Wireless etc) and call centres are never going to be refunded to the customers who have unjustly paid them.

Yours in severe disillusionment and disappointment.

Regards,

NGM

When the bottom line is reached, it has to be the Labour Government who are allowing this 0870 abuse to happen.  They, alone, have the power that can properly deal with Ofcom.
But this Labour Government have actively encouraged the scam at all stages from the day they were elected.  We accepted their lies about not worrying about the new anti-terrorism legislation, then watch as the police invoke them against an 82 year old man at the Labour conference!!
We are sleepwalking into a political abyss - 0870 abuse is merely a small part of the overall plot which, hopefully, may awaken people (but I'm not holding my breath!).

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I'm with you on the above 101% Firestop.

The NGN revenue sharing 084/7 regime in fact started up in 1995 although then 0870 was known as 0990 and 0845 was 0345.  This was all allowed by OFTEL who seem to have somehow been conned into believing it was all just an exercise in large companies having a national and easily redirectable number.  Although revenue share was possibly hidden away there in the rules of what OFTEL originally allowed it was not at all relevant because in 1995 most of us with BT phone lines could not route calls with other phone companies at a cheaper price.

Thus the price of an 0990 call seemed just the same as a national call and 0345 seemed just the same as a local call.  The only difference was that one did not know the geographic location one was dialling.

But just after the Labour government was elected in May 1997 (I remember the timing very well because I only had my current home a few months then and my father also died a week after Labour was elected to office) things changed with 0990 being redefined to 0870 and 0345 to 0845 (I suspect that this may actually have been when current revenue share arrangements were secretly allowed and perhaps it wasn't possible on 0990 and 0345 at all).  At the same time for the first time it was now possible for a BT line customer to route calls on their line with a whole host of other companies using a simple 4 digit indirect access code, and at that time I signed up with a company called AXS Telecom (later Liberty Telecom before being swallowed up by Tiscali) who offered national calls for 2p per minute compared to BT's 7.91p.

From this point on (from way back in 1997 and not just from 1st July 2004 as some of you seem to think) 0870 and 0845 were an obvious problem as I rapidly learned that the 2p per minute I enjoyed with AXS Telecom was not possible for these numbers to which AXS did not route calls.  They only routed calls to numbers starting 01.

I looked into this further and found BT wouldn't even let me add an 0870 number to Friends & Family. I compalined to the Chairmans Office and was told no discount was possible due to advanced call statistics and intelligent routing which were allegedly very expensive and complicated to offer?!

It was annoying but it wasn't a big deal because you see only about one in 10 customer service places I needed to call had one of these horrid numbers or didn't also show a geographic alternative as well.  Also back then in many cases a geographic phone number was still shown in last year's phone booke (pre Voip days).

So while NGN began at the end of the last Conservative government Firestop is right to say that it has only exploded under New Labour and under the totally negligent stewardship of OFTEL and then Ofcom.  And blow me if in 1997 hardly any government agency or department used an 0990 or 0345 but after two or three years of New Labour they were absolutely everywhere in the national and local government sectors.

So although I am sure that amongst the anti 0870 campaigners on this site there must be the odd New Labour supporter (in fact I know of one active Labour member of this forum for sure but he isn't a Blairite and he doesn't believe in accepting Spin) and a few more Lib Dem supporters it does seem to be the case that in order to allow this government to save a very small amount of money at a few agencies (probably worth no more than £10m a year or so) they have allowed us to be subject to further hundreds of millions of punds of scamming a year, most especially in the exploding Pay as You Go mobile market, where 087 and 084 calls usually cost a lot more than 7.51p and 3p a minute and are usually even excluded from bundled call minutes for contract mobile phones.

So yes the reason that Ofcom has delayed, procastinated, stonewalled and avoided taking any action for so long is because that is what its New Labour political masters want.  Its fairly obvious that if Tony Blair and Tessa Jowell were at all concerned about this major national scamming that OFTEL or Ofcom could have totally stamped it out at the stroke of a pen several years ago.

084/7 scamming is not an accident it is a massive unspoken conspiracy between many of the uk's largest telcos and government and the call centre industry all of whom are now very loathed to take their snouts out of the trough.

Sorry Guys but have just got back from t'Pub and found myself listening to a VERY experienced  member of the 'establishment' (a friend really) who thought that as the Telegraph had today published that the 0870 scam was over ... then it was !

Please do watch out for the lower intellect of the media reporter !

Life  ? Don't talk to me about  life .....