Quote:
A disgraceful response. One of the first paragraphs states:

<<
Firstly it must be made clear that consumers do have a choice as to whether or not they decide to dial non-geographic numbers (79% of the research sample agreed with this). In the commercial sector, consumers can choose to dial alternative suppliers. In the public sector there are ways to source the underlying ‘geographic’ number. In fact many bodies will provide consumers with alternative numbers on request.
>>

Pure BS. Downright lies, so beloved by the NTS scammers.

More garbage:

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The second question is ‘Can 0871 numbers be dialled from abroad?’ Of course they cannot. How will businesses that rely predominantly on international trade continue to succeed if they are forced to
migrate onto a 0871 main contact number? It will not look professional if a 0871 number is advertised internationally and callers cannot be connected.
>>

Well, WT, I live abroad, and can't even call the wretched 0870 numbers, let alone your extreme rip-off 0871 variants. Foreign networks will generally treat any +44 8 number in exactly the same way and will charge, assuming termination is possible, a +44 871 number exactly the same as a +44 844 number.

Windsor may be able to fool Ofcom with this crap, but it can't fool me! Why do the responses from the majority of NTS suppliers appear to be written by people that do not seem to be particularly intelligent?

And even more from Redstone:

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Redstone does not believe that there is an issue with revenue sharing on 08 numbers, providing this is understood by consumers. We do not believe that there is an issue with long Call Centre waiting time. Redstone understands the concerns about the use of NTS numbers by essential public services, but believes that there is a role for the use of these numbers in the public sector, providing they are used appropriately.
>>

Unbelievable! They really are out of touch with the wishes of the public. Long call center wait times not an issue? Are these people brainwashed?

The Vodafone response is a total disgrace, yet to be expected by this greedy company. At least BT recognizes the public concerns about NTS, and goes some way to meet such concerns. Vodafone is only concerned about its revenue. As one of the biggest scammers in terms of charges for terminating the public's calls, it stands to lose a lot of money if Ofcom's proposals are carried out. What a shame.

idb wrote on Dec 10^th, 2005 at 12:47pm:


As I highlighted in my response to the "More Information for Consumers" etc Ofcom consultation Vodafone is one of the main reasons such a consultation is necessary and also why all disclosure rules should be statutory and involve large fines for breaches.

Vodafone refuses to provide any sort of call by call cost itemisation for its Pay as You Go customers and even on request or in return for payment you cannot get a properly itemised bill from Vodafone on Pay as You Go if you dispute the reduction in your calling credit.  All they send is a meaningless computer dump (and then only after going to their Chief Executive) separated by control characters which it is impossible to interpret.

Also following a letter to their Chief Exec complaining about 0845 and 0870 charges not being displayed my letter was referred to some female numbskull in customer services who told me there was no separate listing on their website as these calls cost the same as other 01/02 calls.  Only when I pressed the issue again on the phone was I connected to a person in their "Technical" department who knew all their 084/7 NTS rates.

idb wrote on Dec 10^th, 2005 at 4:09am:

They should use a 09 premium rate number then!

Whilst I can understand that they don't want to have to pay for NTS, they can't have their cake and eat it! Do they not understand that the current setup allows telcos to charge pretty much a fixed price, therefore there are no market forces driving down these prices? Do they not understand that typical revenue payments would be a tiny proportion of the overall call cost and that they (as a charity) are forcing their donors to line the pockets of their telco?

So where are the responses to these consultations from Daniel - or Martin Lewis then?  They are not published so far on the Ofcom website.   Or do Ofcom still have some left to publish (they only published my responses and BT's on Friday evening)?  I can see no possible reason for either Messrs Lewis or - asking for their Name to be Withheld on their Response?

Also Dave perhaps you could let some of your old friends on here know by PM which is your response to the consultation since you would have obviously submitted something very worthwhile.

I see Messrs - and Lewis didn't respond to the previous NTS: Options for the Future or Call Termination Market Review consultations either did they?

Can we please have a statement from Daniel about what has happened to his consultation response?

idb wrote on Dec 10^th, 2005 at 2:27pm:

I have reminded the Communications Director of Ofcom about their late response tolerance in respect of its own Consumer Panel, which is in danger of being severely embarassed.

On the point of a SayNoto0870 response that is an impossibility as things stand as we are purely a grass roots movement bound together by website postings and we do not have any of the formal quarterly meetings or AGMs or membership fees so essential to forming a corporate body.  If such a body was formed it would need to become more than SayNoto0870 and become a Consumer pressure group on all telecoms issues.

I also think that as most of our supporters who just look up alternate numbers on this site (but do not post in the forum much or at all) clearly do not consider the matters with the same intellectual rigour as you or I that we should have given them a much clearer message not to answer any of Ofcom's questions (which were rigged) and to instead make our own points on issues such as there being no suggestion to move 0871 and 0844 to 09 and failing to make 0845 geographic rate at the saem time as 0870.  But unfortunately instead a whole lot of rather thoughtless Yes, Yes, Yes responses just using the Plain English questionnaire have been sent that don't achieve very much.  In my opinion only the ones that express opinions of their own should really be counted by Ofcom.  The other ones are from people who are against 0870 but don't understand the comeplexity of the issues or how to express their views on them.

So long as we don't have any AGMs or quarterly meetings etc then inevitably this website is to a large extent anarchic in the conventional sense and there cannot be an overall SayNoto0870 view.

idb wrote on Dec 10^th, 2005 at 3:20pm:


In effect the only view possible as SayNoto0870 would have been one from Daniel who owns the site.  It is my understanding that Daniel, Dave and DaveM have never met one another in person.