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OFCOM, Wrong info again! (Read 46,100 times)
NonGeographicalMan
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #15 - Oct 14th, 2005 at 2:14pm
 
Quote:
No idea who Mr Peacock is ???
This, as you correctly assert, is a "forum" as such am I not at liberty to air my views? I'm certainly not an "Ofcom supporter" but I do believe in being reasonable. And most of you are perhaps expecting too much.
You say most people share your views so "surely [it] must be doing something wrong". How enlightening that you believe the majority is always right. Smiley (You're wrong by the way).


Of course you are quite at liberty to express your views.  We live in a democracy and also this is a democratically run web forum where posts are very rarely deleted by the moderators and threads in this section are virtually never locked.

But I realise you came to this place perhaps somewhat  new in your awareness of the whole 0845 and 0870 higher call cost issue.  You don't have as much background in this dispute as we do.  And we who have been involved for a very long time observe that the 0845 and 0870 problem has only come about due to regulatory incompetence or complicity by OFTEL (Ofcom's predecessor and from which many staff now work at Ofcom) in allowing this revenue sharing to ever take place on numbers that they OFTEL/Ofcom stupidly also allowed to be called National Rate and Local Rate calls even when this was still no longer true.

You I think have been taken in (as Ofcom naturally hope) by the fact that because they Ofcom have just published another consultation on this matter it appears to you that they they are trying to do something for us the consumers. But the reality is that they published a consultation two years ago which they hid and did not promote and when no one responded they said there was no need to do anything about 0845 and 0870.

Then they issued a consultation last year where they got a very big noise back (including BT) that 0845 and 0870 being premium priced calls was wrong and must stop very soon and after considering those views for 9 months instead of acting to stop the scam they launch a new consultation document finishing in Decemember after which they will presumably take 9 more months to reach a decision making only minimal changes (and inadequate changes in the opinion of most people here) not happening untill another one or two years after that.

So that is why I think your view may have been expressed unaware of all the facts in this matter?

Are you aware that the CEO of Ofcom, Mr Stephen Carter, is the former Chief Operating Officer of NTL for instance and that most other senior Ofcom staff (eg Mr Matt Peacock who came from AOL) have previously been working at senior level in the telecoms and broadcasting industries.  So they are not terribly likely to be impartial or unbiased in their views.
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« Last Edit: Oct 14th, 2005 at 10:40pm by N/A »  
 
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dorf
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #16 - Oct 14th, 2005 at 6:11pm
 
And NGM, don't you just like the outrageous confidence of this new member who states that we are "WRONG" to criticise Ofcom or any of these scams (this being implied)! So we have all been wasting our time being wrong according to this know-all who has just arrived on the scene.

Methinks there is more than a hint of Ofcom here. Perhaps this is someone specially assigned to join this forum incogneto and convince us that we are wrong with all of our accusations after all. Obviously we have so much to learn? We have misunderstood the whole scenario! It's really about doing as much for consumers as possible, to help them. Queuing and paying the Premiums with all the tricks is really to help us poor consumers, not to exploit them!
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Ofcom are completely ineffectual
 
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #17 - Oct 14th, 2005 at 10:45pm
 
Quote:
Queuing and paying the Premiums with all the tricks is really to help us poor consumers, not to exploit them!


But of course Dorf since as Ofcom have stated in their latest consultation document these 084 and 087 numbers have in fact been responsible for the creation of many fine and valuable additional services that would not otherwise have existed.

If you cannot remember that you could not previously (before the launch of 084 and 087 numbers) telephone your bank or call a rail company for train times you are clearly suffering from selective amnesia and need to be immediately sent as fast as possible to Ofcom Re-education Camp No 3 to have this very serious memory error corrected. Wink Roll Eyes
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Mr_Asaboa
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #18 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 12:11am
 
Quote:
And NGM, don't you just like the outrageous confidence of this new member who states that we are "WRONG" to criticise Ofcom or any of these scams (this being implied)! So we have all been wasting our time being wrong according to this know-all who has just arrived on the scene.

Methinks there is more than a hint of Ofcom here. Perhaps this is someone specially assigned to join this forum incogneto and convince us that we are wrong with all of our accusations after all. Obviously we have so much to learn? We have misunderstood the whole scenario! It's really about doing as much for consumers as possible, to help them. Queuing and paying the Premiums with all the tricks is really to help us poor consumers, not to exploit them!


I was only voicing an opinion. And if you think companies like Ofcom and TSDs etc look on message forums then I think you're deluded. Don't get me wrong, I think the work that people like NonGeographical Man (and others to be fair) is great and really is making a difference. But I seriously doubt Ofcom would care about a message forum.
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Mr_Asaboa
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #19 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 12:13am
 
Sorry - just to reiterate, I don't think this site is "just a message forum", but I'm just saying I don't think they give two hoots about what people say on a message forum.
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #20 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 12:32am
 
Quote:
I was only voicing an opinion. And if you think companies like Ofcom and TSDs etc look on message forums then I think you're deluded. Don't get me wrong, I think the work that people like NonGeographical Man (and others to be fair) is great and really is making a difference. But I seriously doubt Ofcom would care about a message forum.


You are wrong to thing that Ofcom do not give two hoots about what is posted on this forum.  We have very clear evidence that they monitor comments made here very closely (perhaps because they have every good reason to be more than a little paranoid over the whole 0870 issue)

For instance when after the London bombings I commented that if the bombers had chosen the offices of Ofcom as their target no one would now miss them I received an immediate angry email from the Ofcom Communications Director saying this was a personal attack on his fine and upstanding colleagues, totally unacceptable etc, etc.

Also I received complaints from Mr Peacock that I had been personalising my battle against certain Ofcom staff here in an unnecessary way.  I think he must have had in mind my regular references to their Snoozy and Non Confrontational Director of Policy but also possibly suggestions that the fact the CEO and other senior Ofcom staff came from the telecoms companies potentially gave them a very direct conflict of interest in dealing fairly with major policy issues.
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« Last Edit: Oct 15th, 2005 at 12:33am by N/A »  
 
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Mr_Asaboa
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #21 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 12:54am
 
Quote:
You are wrong to thing that Ofcom do not give two hoots about what is posted on this forum.  We have very clear evidence that they monitor comments made here very closely (perhaps because they have every good reason to be more than a little paranoid over the whole 0870 issue)

For instance when after the London bombings I commented that if the bombers had chosen the offices of Ofcom as their target no one would now miss them I received an immediate angry email from the Ofcom Communications Director saying this was a personal attack on his fine and upstanding colleagues, totally unacceptable etc, etc.

Also I received complaints from Mr Peacock that I had been personalising my battle against certain Ofcom staff here in an unnecessary way.  I think he must have had in mind my regular references to their Snoozy and Non Confrontational Director of Policy but also possibly suggestions that the fact the CEO and other senior Ofcom staff came from the telecoms companies potentially gave them a very direct conflict of interest in dealing fairly with major policy issues.


That's quite interesting. I'm happy to admit that I am surprised that they do in fact monitor this website (and others like it I'm sure). It would be nice if they would take note of some of the things said on here. Having said that, I know someone who was severely injured in the 7/7 attacks so I think that what you said was totally totally out of order. Amazing to think that while we were being attacked you still found it appropriate to have a dig at Ofcom. As a Londoner who works in the City I was caught up in all the grief that week.

Anyways, I'm going off topic. From what you said in your last post I concede, it does seem as though they do monitor such sites as these.  From experience NGM I can tell you that harrassing staff will not get you any results. But reasonable discussion will. I know that tone is often lost in text so I will just say that I am not trying to be arsey at all, merely give some pointers.
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Dave
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #22 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 4:09pm
 
Quote:
For instance when after the London bombings I commented that if the bombers had chosen the offices of Ofcom as their target no one would now miss them I received an immediate angry email from the Ofcom Communications Director saying this was a personal attack on his fine and upstanding colleagues, totally unacceptable etc, etc.

From what you've said in the above paragraph, I quite agree with Mr Peacock's email to you. To use an event such this to "make a point" and/or imply that an organisation for which you don't agree with should be blown up is completely sickening and you should be ashamed of yourself.

Quote:
From experience NGM I can tell you that harrassing staff will not get you any results. But reasonable discussion will. I know that tone is often lost in text so I will just say that I am not trying to be arsey at all, merely give some pointers.

I quite agree personal attacks should not be made. However, I am still reeling from your personal comment that you have contempt for me. So why do you make such personal attacks that you completely deplore?
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joe65
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #23 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 5:12pm
 
[quote author=Mr_Asaboa  link=1129122603/15#21 date=1129334070]

That's quite interesting. I'm happy to admit that I am surprised that they do in fact monitor this website (and others like it I'm sure). It would be nice if they would take note of some of the things said on here. [/quote]

Istn't it only right that Ofcom should keep up with this forum.   As a taxpayer one might consider it neglectful if they didn't.
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There are those who count,&&An' those who cann't,&&An' those who count  on the both of 'em.
 
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #24 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 6:21pm
 
Quote:
From what you've said in the above paragraph, I quite agree with Mr Peacock's email to you. To use an event such this to "make a point" and/or imply that an organisation for which you don't agree with should be blown up is completely sickening and you should be ashamed of yourself.


I didn't say I hoped all Ofcom's staff had been blown up and killed.  I just implied that if Ocom HQ and its staff no longer existed would the general public be any worse off than before?

It was a somewhat unfortunate analogy and I did remove it at the time at Mr Peacock's request.  I only mentioned it again because the strangely named Mr Asaboa didn't believe anyone from Ofcom was reading what is posted here.

But now I am beginning to wish I hadn't mentioned this again at all.

As for Ofcom senior staff I believe it is fair to criticise some of them personally for their faillure to act early enough or drastically enough to stop the 084/7 abuse.  Also the fact that their latest 084/7 consultation suggests that these numbers have been responsible for the creation of useful value added services is surely almost beneath contempt.
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Dave
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #25 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 7:07pm
 
Quote:
I didn't say I hoped all Ofcom's staff had been blown up and killed.  I just implied that if Ocom HQ and its staff no longer existed would the general public be any worse off than before?


But after such an event, that is wrong. It's comparable to politicians "burying bad news" when something like this happens.

Quote:
As for Ofcom senior staff I believe it is fair to criticise some of them personally for their faillure to act early enough or drastically enough to stop the 084/7 abuse. ...

I think it's fair to criticise someone's actions, but not attack them personally. There is obviously a fine line.

Quote:
Also the fact that their latest 084/7 consultation suggests that these numbers have been responsible for the creation of useful value added services is surely almost beneath contempt.

That is Ofcom's conclusion as a whole for which I do not agree because it negates to mention that many other non-value added services operate on 084/7 numbers. However, that is my opinion, and if someone wishes to come on here and say Ofcom are doing a wonderful job, I would disagree with them, and state my reasons why, but they would not be 'wrong'.

This is an important point, and why we (as a campaign group) should not be personally attacking people, but informing them and allowing them to make up their own mind.
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dorf
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #26 - Oct 15th, 2005 at 11:54pm
 
This is the sort of thing that gives Asaboa away. " That's quite interesting. I'm happy to admit that I am surprised that they do in fact monitor this website (and others like it I'm sure)."  First "I am surprised ...." and then "they do in fact monitor this web site (and others like it I'm sure)." How can he firstly claim to be surprised, but then slip up with a statement that he is sure that they monitor it and others like it.

It is so obvious. Be sure your sins will find you out!
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Ofcom are completely ineffectual
 
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Mr_Asaboa
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #27 - Oct 16th, 2005 at 12:32am
 
Quote:
This is the sort of thing that gives Asaboa away. " That's quite interesting. I'm happy to admit that I am surprised that they do in fact monitor this website (and others like it I'm sure)."  First "I am surprised ...." and then "they do in fact monitor this web site (and others like it I'm sure)." How can he firstly claim to be surprised, but then slip up with a statement that he is sure that they monitor it and others like it.

It is so obvious. Be sure your sins will find you out!


Poor sentense construction more than anything. Dork, you're really funny. You're my favourite guy on here because you are so wrapped up in your  conspiracy theory that I'm the CEO of Ofcom. Gahaha!! Cheesy Dork - sorry, Dorf - do really think that the CEO of Ofcom (or any company for that matter) wouldcome on here? If as you are saying they don't care about your pedantry complaints, why would they come on here??

Anyways, I don't want to ruin your fun, so yes I am the CEO of Ofcom. Can you call me Sir Asaboa in future please? Thanks.
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dorf
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #28 - Oct 16th, 2005 at 6:59pm
 
Mr. Asaboa, it is not me that has at any time claimed that you are the CEO of Ofcom. It is quite clear to me that you are not of that calibre, from your spelling and the way you write. I suggested that you might be some sort of plant representing them or another with similar interests, assigned to post comments here to convince us that we have misunderstood the whole scenario.

I actually believe now that you are more likely to be someone with a vested interest in these scams continuing, some one for instance like "Loopytush"?
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« Last Edit: Oct 16th, 2005 at 7:00pm by dorf »  

Ofcom are completely ineffectual
 
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Dave
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Re: OFCOM, Wrong info again!
Reply #29 - Dec 8th, 2005 at 5:24pm
 
This revised User's Guide to Telephone Numbering has not come online yet. There is a message saying it will be ready by the end of January 2006. Why does it take Ofcom to make changes? Or is it starting from scratch?

It's a "User's guide," so I presume that it's meant for normal consumers to read and understand rather than full of loads of telecom-speak. Do they only have one wordprocessor in the office, or is it a slow typer? Roll Eyes
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