10 years ago the cost of a national call was approx 8ppm via BT…

10 years ago many businesses were offered an 0870 number ‘for life’…

The telecoms market evolved, prices of national calls tumbled, competition opened up and eventually there was a huge delta between the cost of a national call and the cost of calling an 0870 number… In turn, this opened up the opportunity for revenue share and the possibility to fund network level services.

Clearly there was a need to address this ‘delta’ and to improve price transparency for the consumer…

However, what have we got ?  A complete mess !  Ofcom ends revenue sharing on 0870 and introduces a new 0370 range for migration… what does this ‘actually’ mean to consumers, businesses and telcos ?

Are consumers going to benefit – doubtful… faced with the cost of setting up and promoting new numbers are businesses really going to choose 0370 ?  More likely there will be a mass migration to 0871 (at 10ppm)… which is not good news for anybody !

Are businesses going to benefit – absolutely not !  Just for a moment consider the pain, effort and cost involved in setting up and promoting new contact numbers to consumers and suppliers – updating websites, re-printing brochures, letterheads, business cards, signage etc.  Potentially, this will costs businesses tens of thousands of pounds – are they then going to migrate to 0370 and start paying for calls received ?

Are telcos going to benefit – not really… The fact is whatever NTS range businesses use telcos will take a margin – whether it’s 0800, 0844, 0845, 0870, 0871 or even 0370… the one thing we can be fairly sure of is that most businesses will not revert back to geographic numbers and pay for in-house equipment to replace their network-level services.

So… who actually benefits from these Ofcom proposals ?

We’re on no-one’s side here… we just want to try and make sure businesses are informed and aware of what viable options they have going forward.

If you’re one of the 600,000 UK businesses that currently use 0870 numbers and are concerned about the Ofcom proposals visit www.0870advice.com for more info.

Cheers,
0870Advice

0870advice.com wrote on Nov 9^th, 2006 at 8:45am:

Good grief!  600,000 business!

That's at least 599,990 with which I won't deal and ten with which I have to deal but which I won't phone.

Never realised it was that many ripping us off!

From their site:

"Clearly, Ofcom’s proposals mean that any business that currently generates income through 0870 numbers will soon lose this revenue stream and instead be charged for calls received.

Therefore, those businesses will need to choose between keeping their existing 0870 numbers and paying a charge for calls received or introducing new contact numbers.

Potentially, this decision will depend on the pain, effort and cost involved in promoting new contact numbers on websites, brochures, other printed material, signage etc.

If the choice is to look at migrating away from 0870 then a number of viable options are available from freephone to premium rate and even reverting back to 01/02 geographic numbers.

This decision may well depend on whether businesses have (and rely on) network level services such as call queuing, IVR or call recording.  If this is the case, any move back to geographic numbers will have to include budget for replacing these services with in-house equipment."


Aaaah!

You state on your website, 0870advice:-

Quote:


Where is your proof that companies will be charged for calls received?  I agree that for those companies using call routing, IVR, etc may have to pay monthly/annual fee, etc for these services (line rental so-to-speak) but why should they be charged for receiving calls on this number?  Simply so the underlying CP can still take their massive cuts.

For example, let's take CP, www.goldnumbers.com that charge businesses, etc wanting one of their 0845 (again misleadingly advertised as local rate) numbers but are expected to pay 3p/min for every call they receive but yet there are many other teleco's out there that don't charge for incoming calls at all.

All I want is for us consumers to be fully informed that NTS numbers are in fact premium rate numbers (because they cost more than geographical numbers) albeit smaller premium rate compared to 09x which can cost upto £1.50p/min (from a BT landline) because if this was to happen then consumers would complain and companies would be forced to use lower NTS numbers and/or the new 03x number range.

Of course companies don't like to admit they are receiving revenue from 08 NTS numbers for this exact same reason hence why they use 08 NTS numbers instead of 09x numbers as all consumers are fully aware that 09x numbers are premium rate whereas consumers think that 08 NTS numbers are local/national rate.

Why do so many (if not all) teleco's offering NTS numbers misleadingly state that calls to 084x are local rate and calls to 087x are national rate?  Again, simply because it's not good business (for the teleco's) to be forthcoming and state the truth that calls to NTS numbers are NOT local/national rate and can cost upto (in some circumstances) 40p/min.

Hi BBB_UK (again !),

Once again tend to agree with you on your points relating to businesses having to publicise the cost of the call.  This all relates to more price transparency and I'm afraid this should not be down to CPs - it should dictated by Ofcom...

Our view is that the NTS review has just added further confusion on NTS pricing and will confuse the consumer even more.

At least via www.0870advice.com we're attempting to keep businesses informed - surely this is a step forward ?

Cheers,
0870Advice

0870advice.com wrote on Nov 9^th, 2006 at 12:30pm:
Which is commendable except the website still maintains the deception that 084x is local and 087x is national rate and implying that its not worth companies keeping with 0870 as they've to pay an incoming per minute charge - and similar things for 0845 where you state that an incoming per minute charge is payable.  All this is untrue as many companies don't charge for incoming calls on 0845 numbers (as I mentioned earlier).

Quote:
They've tried a little but too late though if you ask me as consumer confusion over 08 NTS numbers being local/national rate is too much especially when teleco's still misleadingly state these calls are local/national rate.  They could do a lot more but are unwilling so as not to hurt companies, teleco's using these numbers.

0870advice.com wrote on Nov 9^th, 2006 at 12:41pm:
If you're referring to my points on the fact that CPs misleadingly state that calls to 08 NTS numbers are charged at local/national rate then I disagree because it is the teleco that is misleading customers so Ofcom shouldn't have to force teleco's to stop this misleading claim as its the teleco that are being dishonest.  On the other hand, it is very clear that teleco's want to continue this lie about local/national rate so now Ofcom should force teleco's such as yours to stop these misleading claims.

The point is this misleading lie is too widespread to expect teleco's to do this of their own accord especially as they (teleco's) don't want to tell the truth as their profit margins would be affected by it so instead continue the lie and the scam so they (teleco's) can continue to get more customers (ie businesses) signing up to these so-called local/national rate numbers on false pretences.

Dear BBB_UK,

We need to clear something up here...

CPs sell 0845 and 0870 numbers to businesses who are 'fully aware' of what the cost will be to their customers.

We have no control of whether they then publicise the actual cost of the call to their customers.

It is the consumers who need to be made fully aware of the cost of 0845 and 0870 numbers and the consumers need to be made aware of the now inaccurate association with local and national rates.

As I said right at the start... We were in total agreement that there was (and still is) a need for more price transparency.

These proposals from Ofcom just make things even more confusing for the consumer...

It should be down to Ofcom (or associated Government bodies) to either dictate that businesses publicise the cost of the call to the consumer (as with Premium rate) or run some sort of publicity campaign to try and make more consumers aware.

I don't agree that the responsibility lies with the CPs - all of our customers are fully aware of the cost to the caller of any NTS number we provide.

Additionally, as I stated in first post... Whatever NTS number we provide we make a similar margin - 0800, 0844, 0845, 0870, 0871 etc - so there is no incentive for us to 'keep these lies so bad' !

Cheers,
0870Advice

0870advice.com wrote on Nov 9^th, 2006 at 3:23pm:
Yes CPs do but they do so by misleadingly advertising that 084x is local rate and 087x is national rate so then businesses think well consumers are only being charged local or national rate for any call to them.

Ofcom, ASA and Trading Standards all agree that describing 08 NTS calls as either local rate or national rate is misleading but so far Ofcom fail to do anything.  The ASA and Trading Standards do enforce hence why in non-broadcast adverts you now see the actual cost of calls to 08 NTS numbers and no longer can you mention they are local or national rate.

For example, your GoldNumbers website clearly is misleading potential customers and can be reported to Trading Standards but I personally think that Ofcom has to force CPs to stop these misleading lies about local or national rate simply because there are so many OCPs and CPs that still continue this lie.

Quote:
I realise CPs have no control over the cost hence why 08 NTS numbers can cost upto 40p/min from some mobile networks.  I was referring to OCP (those that actually have control over how they charge to certain number ranges like BT, NTL, TalkTalk, etc) they are currently required to provide clear/transparent info for us consumers but in most cases choose not to.  Ofcom are aware of this and are looking into it but as its seems to be standard practice for Ofcom to take 6 months plus to investigate these things - us consumers suffer in the interim.  This is not your fault as a CP and I admit that - it's Original Communication Providers that are obliged to follow this new regulation but so far fail.

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How can any reasonable person expect a consumers to be fully aware of the inaccuracies associated with 08 and their continued misleading descriptions of local rate and national rate when ALL OCP's and CP purposely still continue to go around misleading people with these inaccuracies.

Basically, even if a consumer did have some doubts about the cost of these calls then they would naturally visit their OCP website or any other OCP or CP for which it would basically state that NTS calls are local rate and national rate so therefore it is perfectly reasonable for a consumer to think that's its true simply due to how many teleco's actually still continue this lie.

Quote:
Yes we are in agreement that there needs to be more price transparency but what I'm saying is that it doesn't help consumers become more aware of the 'actual' costs of these numbers if they are continually described as being either local rate or national rate.  A real local or national rate (ie geographical call) costs a maximum of 3p/min from a BT landline regardless of if you call someone around the corner or calling from London to Scotland - it all costs 3p/min.

It does become misleading when CPs state that calls to 084x/087x are either local rate or national rate simply because they would end up paying more for the call than a proper local rate or national rate.