0870advice.com wrote on Nov 13^th, 2006 at 12:12pm:
That makes sense and I forgot that the TCP charge per minute for calls ending on their network (not to mention any other provider that may be involved).

The fee can't be that great though as for example, call08.com, only charge 4.95 per month for a freephone number and this allows upto 500 minutes inclusive per month before being charged to receive incoming calls and then it's 2p/min.  Which is very good value I would have thought for a freephone number.

As a per minute fee would be payable to the TCP then I guess that means our hopes of the new 03x range not having an incoming per minute charge is very, very slim.  As this is the case the incentive for companies/gov depts, etc to migrate to an 03x number will be less as it is going to cost them to receive calls.

0870advice.com wrote on Nov 13^th, 2006 at 5:07pm:

But don't geographical providers charge? Most calls will of course, go to BT. Don't 'inclusive' packages exist because the price charged allows to OCP to pay to terminating these calls? Thus, prices will have to go up for these packages?

Can these per-minute charges by TCPs be reduced/done away with, or am I right in assuming that it is down to the TCP what they charge?

Each call to an 03 number will have to be relayed by BT so they will levy a charge to pass it off to the host telco who will have to pay that charge and pay to terminate the call then add their mark up.  Whatever charge is made to the caller none of that revenue will go in any way towards subsidising the cost of the BT handover or the call termination fee, so in a nutshell BT will indeed be the ones laughing all the way to the bank as you've said! 

03xx is actually quite a threat to competition as it will potentially be very difficult, if not impossible, to compete with BT on this numbering range.  I do say this in advance of any pricing information being released, but looking at the transit model its difficult to arrive at any other conclusion.

0870advice.com

0870advice.com wrote on Nov 13^th, 2006 at 8:29pm:

But with the way it works at the moment, we all have to pay (pretty much) old BT rates for these calls. Is it not keeping this high call rate that has allowed companies such as yours into the marketplace? In which case, the competition has done nothing to alleviate these high prices.

And you talk about tight profit margins. But the original brief was to drive down prices that had been defined by BT. I do not see that this is really happening.

0870advice,

Here is something you may be able to answer!  I realise your company is just a CP and not an OCP but you may still know.

When Ofcon announced the new 03x range they said it will cost national geographical rate (and be included in inclusive plans, etc).  Now I'm unsure why Ofcom said it will cost the same as national geographical rate when as far as us consumers are aware, calls to local or national geographical calls are the same (except those on BT's LUS).

Did Ofcom state this because internally, calls to local and national geographical numbers are still charged for separately?  Ie, calls to local geographicals are cheaper that calls to national geographicals?

0870advice.com wrote on Nov 15^th, 2006 at 12:24pm:


I think bbb was asking whether the wholesale cost of a local area call vs a national call to an 01/02 number was now the same to a call originating company like BT or whether their costs for the two types of call were still different even though on most price plans (apart from BT Light User) the customer now pays the same for local and national 01/02 calls.

Yep NGMGhost, that's what I was asking.

I'm still curious why Ofcom said 03x range would be chargable at national geographical rates (for those without inclusive plans, etc)!!

Never mind.


0870advice,

You keep mentioning 0370?  I didn't realise Ofcom have only specifically announced that number range!  I thought other number ranges within 03x will be available like easy-to-remember ones for charaties/gov depts, etc given preference.

OK Guys,

Here's a couple of out-takes from NTS FAQs (http://www.ofcom.org.uk/media/mofaq/telecoms/nts/) which may answer your questions... or may not !

4. How much will 0870 calls cost when the changes have been implemented?

As proposed in September 2005, Ofcom will require mobile and fixed-line providers (including payphones) to charge the same or less for 0870 calls as they do for national-rate calls to geographic numbers (starting 01 or 02). If providers wish to charge more for 0870 calls they will have to make a free-to-caller price pre-announcement at the start of the call.

This change is likely to significantly reduce the price of many calls to 0870 numbers. It will also mean that 0870 calls will generally be included in call packages. Currently daytime 0870 calls usually cost around 8 pence per minute from fixed-lines. Typical fixed-line call packages offer calls to geographic numbers at 3 pence per minute or less.

The requirement to charge no more than the rate for geographic calls will also extend to all-calls packages and bundled-minutes. So for example, if you have subscribed to a package that allows you to make national calls to geographic numbers at no charge then 0870 calls must also be free of charge. Similarly if your subscription has a call allowance that includes national calls to geographic numbers then you will also be able to use the allowance to make 0870 calls.

8. When the changes to 0870 numbers are implemented, how will 0870 differ from the new 03 number range proposed in Ofcom’s Numbering Review? Why would organisations choose to use 03 instead?

The 0870 and 03 ranges will be very similar after the changes to 0870 are implemented. Both with have tariffs linked to geographic rates and neither will support revenue sharing in practice.

The changes to 0870 are designed to repair the linkage to geographic tariffs that is currently broken whilst allowing service providers to retain their existing numbers if they wish.

Ofcom has proposed to introduce the 03 range to accommodate future growth for services that do not require revenue sharing since the 0870 range is filling up and will eventually run out of spare capacity.

Ofcom's hopes that in time the new range will become trusted by consumers as covering clearly-understood services and price ranges. Some organisations currently using 0870 numbers may find the 03 brand attractive and decide to move their services to 03 numbers.


NGMs Ghost - I think we discussed the network message earlier... and the potential 'mis-use' of this facility !

The best laid plans...........................