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SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition (Read 202,219 times)
NGMsGhost
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #60 - Feb 5th, 2007 at 10:56pm
 
idb I feel almost as though I could have written your last post myself.  I think you have identified all the key issues involving these abuses.

Interesting item about an incendiary device at the office of Capita today which revealed the full extent of their massive call centre and outsourcing empire.

When one notes the close connection between Capita and the Labour party I feel sure this is precisely why Ofcom are under strict instructions to totally fudge action on NTS revenue share while being quite happy to crack down on junk food advertising to children, encrypted Sky porn channels that dare to show real hard core porn, and needless silent calls that actually cost the incompetent companies that make them extra money.
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #61 - Feb 5th, 2007 at 11:27pm
 
NGMsGhost wrote on Feb 5th, 2007 at 10:56pm:
idb I feel almost as though I could have written your last post myself.  I think you have identified all the key issues involving these abuses.

Interesting item about an incendiary device at the office of Capita today which revealed the full extent of their massive call centre and outsourcing empire.

When one notes the close connection between Capita and the Labour party I feel sure this is precisely why Ofcom are under strict instructions to totally fudge action on NTS revenue share while being quite happy to crack down on junk food advertising to children, encrypted Sky porn channels that dare to show real hard core porn, and needless silent calls that actually cost the incompetent companies that make them extra money.
I am surprised that there has not been an investigative documentary into Capita and its businesses. I read today that it has recently been awarded a contract to provide services to Swindon council (http://www.sharecast.com/cgi-bin/sharecast/story.cgi?story_id=1057022).

I can confidently predict that the 01793 contact number on http://www.swindon.gov.uk/ will not be around for much longer.

It really beggers belief that, on the basis of a couple of complaints about porn, Ofcom takes such disproportionate action against a satellite channel, yet with over one thousand complaints in the form of consultation responses to NGN charging, it does virtually nothing.

The only way forward will be for either some deaths resulting directly from the inability to get through to some wretched NEG 0844 number, or a catastrophic incident in the UK with the subsequent inappropriate use of, say an 0871 number, to get some politician to take a long hard look at what is going on. I wish for neither of these, but this is what it is going to take.

The lunatics are firmly in charge at Riverside House and they are not going to give up without a fight.
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #62 - Feb 5th, 2007 at 11:40pm
 
It's also worth remembering that Matt Peacock, Communications Director for Ofcom (and still in his job) admitted to these numbers being premium rate at the end of 2004 and that something would be done in 2005. Perhaps it's worth including this in a new petition.
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NGMsGhost
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #63 - Feb 6th, 2007 at 12:50am
 
Dave wrote on Feb 5th, 2007 at 11:40pm:
It's also worth remembering that Matt Peacock, Communications Director for Ofcom (and still in his job) admitted to these numbers being premium rate at the end of 2004 and that something would be done in 2005. Perhaps it's worth including this in a new petition.


And even more to the point its all recorded and can be played back to him too.

Peacock was clearly speaking off message at the time and probably hadn't yet become aware of the special protective measures for 084/7 calls being demanded by Capita, Sky and other important friends of New Labour. Wink
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NGMsGhost
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #64 - Feb 7th, 2007 at 5:19pm
 
Interestingly I see that neither the site owner or definitely Dave and possibly bbb have signed this petition and nor have other site stalwarts like idb, Tanllan or dorf.

How did we come to give star billing to a petition with wording none of us are comfortable signing and that stupidly only mentions 0845 rather than 084x numbers, when 084x are soon going to be an even bigger problem, as they already are with the NEG doctors surgery scam of course.

The petition is at 2,500 or so, although I'm sure we could get it to 200,000 if we paid a spam emailing house to email every email address they have in the UK.  Much though I don't condone spam emailing on the whole at least this would be a topic that many recipients would actually want to hear about.

But the wording in the petition isn't right for me.  Any petition that I sign over 084/7 must also feature the incompetence and negligence of Ofcom in failing to correctly deal with the issues involved.
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« Last Edit: Feb 7th, 2007 at 5:20pm by NGMsGhost »  

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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #65 - Feb 9th, 2007 at 7:35pm
 

Are we going to go for a better worded and well advertised petition. I think we should. I think we should let thie current one run its course and them go for it again with the wording agreed here before it is posted and a campaign for signatures. 

Also just wondered whether you still thought the Road pricing petition wasn't fixed. It currently stands at just under 1 million and having just done a few samplings (7.30 pm) the signing rate is currently at an average of about 5000 per hour!!!!!!!

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NGMsGhost
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #66 - Feb 9th, 2007 at 7:50pm
 
Keith wrote on Feb 9th, 2007 at 7:35pm:
Are we going to go for a better worded and well advertised petition. I think we should. I think we should let thie current one run its course and them go for it again with the wording agreed here before it is posted and a campaign for signatures.


Well I have given the current one a plug in a thread on the www.adslguide.org.uk forum where some idiot tried to convince me 0870 was National Rate and on www.tivocommunity.com and their Tivo UK section saying if people don't like Tivo's 0870 number with Sky this is the way to complain.  As a result signatures on the 0870 petition shot up by around 100 in less than an hour.  Promotion elsewhere in forums sympathetic to the subject in question is very important.  I don't know if there is even a thread about the petition yet on the MSE site yet.  If there was I would have thought signatures would have hit more than 3,000.

I would favour a petition next time directly condeming the failure of Ofcom to act to protect the citizen consumer by not ensuring that these numbers could not be called local and national rate and condemning their failure to force mandatory free call price announcements (unless people choose to opt out) and their failure to educate uk consumers about the costs of calling different types of UK number.  I would also express concern about the massive costs of running Ofcom and the high salaries of its senior executives in relation to its total ineffectiveness in serving the interests of the UK citizen consumer who are its principal duty.

Embarassing Ofcom who are at the root cause of the continuation of this scam is the only way to get any action.

Quote:
Also just wondered whether you still thought the Road pricing petition wasn't fixed. It currently stands at just under 1 million and having just done a few samplings (7.30 pm) the signing rate is currently at an average of about 5000 per hour!!!!!!!


If they have a team of people constantly posting in every UK car and transport related forum in numerous threads mentioning the petition and where to sign it and if bodies like the national federation of road hauliers etc are encouraging all their truckers to sign in their newsletter and/or any trucker newsletters etc and this is a major talking point in the trucker and company rep fraternities then it is just about credible they could get this number of signatures although it ought to slow down soon.  Suppose if every trucker stop has a sign up saying to sign this petition - then that would get an awful lot of signatures as this proposal threatens all of these people's livelihoods.
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« Last Edit: Feb 9th, 2007 at 7:51pm by NGMsGhost »  

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NGMsGhost
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #67 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 10:12pm
 
The anti 084/7 petition now has 3946 signatures and has risen to position 26 in the list so half way up the front page of petitions.  Its recently overtaken a raft of petitions that were all within a few votes of each other but now has about 600 signatured to go before it hits the next one.

Mind you its put on about 500 signature since this morning when I watched the anti road toll petition cross the 1 million mark.  It now has around 1.1 million signatures.  It seems that at least some of the real people directly signing the anti road toll petition in person on the site are looking at the other petitions on the front page and seeing the anti 084/7 one and finding that they agree with it are signing it.  Loads of the other petitions the anti 084/7 one has overtaken have hardly been making any progress at all today, although some of them represent very narrow interest groups compared to the widespread appeal of opposition to 084/7

I'm suspicious as to whether the road toll petition signatures are genuine because the people signing are in general signing so few of the other petitions on the front page.  Personally I would have expected that if they got that far they would look at the other petitions on the first page and sign any they agree with.  Clearly there are several tens of thousands of real people who have signed the anti road toll petition (myself included) but the fact that it increases at 100 a minute or more slightly beggars belief.

Perhaps some newspapers have provided a simple front end to sign though without those signing not getting to see or be aware of the other petiitions on the 10 Downing Street petitions site?

Anyhow coming back to this petition if it carries on at this rate it may well end up in the top 5 soon.
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #68 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 10:14pm
 
5 minutes later and its increased by 9 signatures to 3955.  I wonder if links have been posted on some other campaigning sites somewhere?
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« Last Edit: Feb 10th, 2007 at 10:15pm by NGMsGhost »  

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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #69 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 11:03pm
 
Something has certainly changed as (sadly) I have been monitoring the petition and typically it was running at 25 - 40 signatures an hour during the working day and the rate dropping significantly in the evenings and the weekends. However the trend has changed this Saturday with postings matching if not exceeding previous weekday day time postings.

The petition has obviously passed many many petitions, but one petition has passed it, the one on CBT. However the Red Arrows petition was catching up very very fast, but is now dropping back with the renewed impetus to the 08** petition.

Looking good. Wonder if OFCOM know about it?
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #70 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 11:33pm
 
Keith wrote on Feb 10th, 2007 at 11:03pm:
Looking good. Wonder if OFCOM know about it?


You can be sure Ofcom will notice it if it gets into the top 10 and journalists start commenting on it. Anyhow its especially likely to get noticed at the moment if it gets that high due to all the people looking at the anti road tolls petition.

I believe Ofcom Communication Director, Matt Peacock, still keeps an eye on the site to see what we are up to although he decided to refuse to talk to me any more after I suggested he only stayed on at Ofcom as he couldn't get a job anywhere else with such a high paid salary.  He suggested this was an "ad hominem" (that is "attacking the man" for those of you who do not speak Latin) remark, something that goes on all the time in the world of Politics but is apparently unacceptable towards Ofcom's extremely well paid but far from very effective civil servants.  Or perhaps he has finally realised that as his colleagues completely betrayed the promises he made to us on Radio 4 over two years ago that there is no point in him trying to play Mr Nice Guy with us any more.
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« Last Edit: Feb 10th, 2007 at 11:33pm by NGMsGhost »  

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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #71 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 11:35pm
 
P.S. Surely all that has changed on the rate of weekend signup is the number of weekend newspapers and radio and tv programs all mentioning the road tolls petition so bringing people to the website and then stumbling on the 084/7 petition.
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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #72 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 1:54am
 
I am puzzled by this thread.  Surely the problem that this site feels so strongly about has been FULLY addressed by Ofcom and it just will not exist by this time next year.  OK, a year, but the problem is so serious that industry must be given time to work out what to do about cut revenues etc.  No silly partitioning the government is going to bring the solution forward more quickly than that!

Yogi2

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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #73 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 9:53am
 
Yogi2 wrote on Feb 11th, 2007 at 1:54am:
I am puzzled by this thread.  Surely the problem that this site feels so strongly about has been FULLY addressed by Ofcom and it just will not exist by this time next year.  OK, a year, but the problem is so serious that industry must be given time to work out what to do about cut revenues etc.  No silly partitioning the government is going to bring the solution forward more quickly than that!

Yogi2


Dear Yogi or should I call you Mr 084/7 Call Centre Director,

As I'm sure you are perfectly well aware Ofcom is not addressing the matter of revenue share on 084 or 0871 numbers in Feb 2008 and is also alllowing a get out for 0870 numbers as long as they have an announcement the call price is not the normal geographic rate.  And although this does not allow revenue share directly to the end user to continue on 0871 any more I am sure Ofcom would not have allowed its existence if mobile phone companies and the like were not telling it in secret that they were still intending to rip people off over 0870 numbers.

But anyhow we fully expect the main 0870 exploiters to move either en bloque to 0871 at 10p per minute at all times if the new ICSTIS regulations are weak and hide the fact it is premium rate sufficiently or to 0844 at 5p per times if ICSTIS regulations look too tough.

From the tone of your enquiry I do not believe it is genuine anyway since you clearly are informed enough to know about the Ofcom proposals and thus you also know that the minor change by Ofcom next year will not stop the generality of the 084/7 call centre ripoff.

Still it seems that in this case you may not be smarter than the average bear after all though. Wink Roll Eyes Grin
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« Last Edit: Feb 11th, 2007 at 9:53am by NGMsGhost »  

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Re: SayNoTo0870.com E-Petition
Reply #74 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 10:25am
 
Yes, Yogi2, we SHOULD 'partition' the government - into as many pieces as possible!!!

NGM,  why do these people still keep putting their heads above the wall??  Too easy for you - but I suppose some easy 'target practice' helps the day along!

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