Hi

I was just interested to know whether other countries in the EU have the same problems; with adult services migrating from 090xx to 0871 are similar things happening in Germnay, France, Spian etc.

cheers in advance 

Luc

Surely the principal reason for this migration is that many are realising that although the 0871 rates may be lower than the maximum 09 rates, in the long run more total revenue can be made by using 0871 or 070PNS numbers! This is because call queuing and all other call-duration extrapolation techniques are allowed with 0871 and 070PNS, whereas they are specifically prohibited with 09 overt Premium numbers.

It is for exactly this reason also that many 0870 scamsters are moving over to use 0871 numbers. This is precisely why Ofcom would not force current 0871 users to 09 and why they have deliberately kept shy of full ICSTIS control for 0871. They want 0871 to be the main escape route from 0870 for their telecoms buddies, so they are deliberately attempting to define it as an anomaly - half under the control of ICSTIS, but avoiding the stricter controls (like the prohibition of call queuing and all other call-duration extrapolation techniques etc. for Premium numbers), and so as to parry a need to specifically label 0871 as a "Premium" number category!

It continuously amazes me that so many people who are incensed about NGNs other than 09 being used as Premium numbers, in all but name, still do not seem to understand that the foundation of these scams is that call queuing and call duration extrapolation are not prohibited on any NGN other than 09. This is how the really big money is made from NGN abuse.

lucaltmann wrote on Jan 24^th, 2007 at 4:25pm:

A similar website exists for Germany, see discussion here.

dorf wrote on Jan 25^th, 2007 at 12:10pm:


I agree with all those points dorf, although the one other additional issue you miss is that the reason the scammers so love 0871 numbers is precisely because the average uninformed member of the public would simply imagine them to be an overflow range of 0870 numbers and so charged on the same basis.  And the average uninformed member of the public would also wrongly imagine an 0870 number cost to only be the same as National Rate and so no more than calling an 01/02 number.  Sadly this misunderstanding is further extended to then thinking 0871 is National Rate as well even though neither are charged at this rate.

Then the utterly useless and corrupt Ofcom aids and abets this process by doing nothing to publicise the fact that 0870 and 0871  numbers are not National Rate but are revenue share/premium rate calls charged at different rates.  The useless Ofcom also expects the ASA to sort this mess out for them but ignores the fact that the ASA does not control website advertising nor any materials which are not advertising but merely police or local government information leaflets etc.

Ofcom are at the route of this evil by having allowed 0871 to now be used for premium rate activities so that the number confusion with 0870 misdescribed National Rate would occur and then allowing ICSTSIS to water down the controls used over 0871 so they do not begin to resemble normal premium rate number control.

Ofcom are an utterly despicable organisation run by individuals with no principles for whom it is hard to have any respect.

a very nice man wrote on Jan 24^th, 2007 at 4:57pm:



Some "09" numbers are in fact the same price as 0871 - 10p/min,  "09" are regulated, but 0871 are not.