SAYNOTO0870.COM - Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844

Dave

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #30 - Sep 12^th, 2007 at 7:39pm

irrelevant wrote on Sep 12^th, 2007 at 5:04pm:

What is the maximum an 08* is charged from a BT landline??

Different 0844 numbers are charged at different rates from BT landlines. The maximum BT 'pricing point' for 0844 is 5p/min at all times. AFAIK, Virgin Media and Talk Talk charges are the same as BT for 0844 and 0871. 0871 is like 0844 in that there loads of different rate numbers within the prefix and they can go up to 10p/min at all times.

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Dave Global Moderator Offline Posts: 9,902 Yorkshire Gender:	Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844 Reply #31 - Sep 12^th, 2007 at 8:14pm There was also a report on BBC Points West this evening. Watch online here. Homepage for Points West is: http://www.bbc.co.uk/pointswest/
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loddon

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #32 - Sep 12^th, 2007 at 8:25pm

BBC TV in the South West ran a story this evening within their Regional programme "Points West".

The story is titled "Doctors' surgeries under fire". You can see this 5 min clip here : ---

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pointswest/ and click on the title under TOP STORIES --- Watch Now on the right hand side of the screen. Liam Fox MP again makes an appearance.

Happy viewing.

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« Last Edit: Sep 12^th, 2007 at 8:26pm by loddon »

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mikeinnc

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #33 - Sep 12^th, 2007 at 8:50pm

I think the one point that is so often missed is that for the greater majority of subscribers, a call to 01 or 02 (or 03!) is included in their calling plan and there is no incremental cost. To keep saying that it is 5p compared to 3p per minute, whilst true, really misses the point, and may even sound like 'sour grapes'. After all, '...it's only 2p.....' as I'm sure NEG would be saying.

Well, it's not! For most people, it's probably 5p per MINUTE vs NOTHING

How can that point be reinforced? After all, 0p per minute is a LOT better than 5p a minute! Ten times zero is still....zero! Wink

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derrick

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #34 - Sep 13^th, 2007 at 4:56pm

Heinz wrote on Sep 12^th, 2007 at 7:17pm:

loddon wrote on Sep 12^th, 2007 at 5:27pm:

It would appear, as some others have suspected, at that time the DoH were advised erroneously that 0844 numbers were charged at normal rate and were not revenue sharing and would remove the problem of 0870. This advice was accepted by the DoH and they were misled in exactly the same way as doctors and others are constantly being misled since 2005 about the true cost (to callers) and the nature of 0844 numbers. The fact is, however, that 0844 ARE revenue sharing and can be seen to be significantly more costly than normal geographic numbers and only reduce the 0870 problem but do not eliminate it.

5p/minute is 54% per minute more than the 3¼p/minute that a peak rate UK 01/02 call from a BT Together Option 1 landline costs.

And that's ignoring manipulated call queuing ........

And if you have to use a pay phone,( the cost of which I obtained from somewhere on this forum ), 01/02 2p per minute, 0844 14p per minute, a 600% premium.

Some one will correct me if I got the prices wrong Roll Eyes

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irrelevant

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #35 - Sep 13^th, 2007 at 5:46pm

Here is the definitive price guide for charges from BT public payphones.

0844 = 43 seconds per 10p, plus 20p connection charge, minumum total charge of 40p.

So a 3 minute call will cost you 70p (actually gives you 3m35s).

Local and national calls you get 600 seconds per 10p (10 mins) plus 20p connection, minumum 40p,.

So a 3 min call will cost you 40p. (actually gives you 20mins)

Oh, and 0871 numbers get you 12 seconds per 10p. That 3 min call is £1.70.

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irrelevant

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #36 - Sep 13^th, 2007 at 5:52pm

Dave wrote on Sep 12^th, 2007 at 7:39pm:

0871 is like 0844 in that there loads of different rate numbers within the prefix and they can go up to 10p/min at all times.

Yep, I found the list: here. How is ANYONE supposed to know the price of a call when the charge band is defined by anyhtng up to EIGHT digits! (and, e.g, all 0844 094 is defined as one price, except 0844 0945 and 0844 0959 which are two different prices... )

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loddon

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #37 - Sep 14^th, 2007 at 8:55am

pw4 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2007 at 4:20pm:

To Mike Forster,
...
I think you are incorrect about 0844/5 numbers being encouraged.
...

Mr Forster is not mistaken.

Quote:

Department of Health, 24th February 2005.
GP practices currently using national rate telephone lines will be expected to change these to 'lo-call' numbers, under an arrangement between the Department of Health and the principal supplier. The department will make funding of around £500 per practice available for them to switch from national rate to lo-call numbers. The department will be working with PCTs to identify which practices will be entitled to the additional funding.

pw4, as I mentioned before and as your quote from 24/02/05 says, GP practices then using 0870 were required to change their number to something else which was acceptable, but other doctors were not "encouraged" to go to 0844. What was actually said at the time was : ---
"Health Minister John Hutton announced a ban on the use of national and premium rate telephone numbers (‘087’ and ‘09’) by the NHS in February 2005. At the time, the Department announced that it would consider the use of ‘084’ numbers in the light of a review of telephone numbering being carried out by Ofcom. "

This was in no way encouraging all or any doctors to abandon their geographic numbers and move to 0844 so I think my point to Mike Forster was valid.

The NHS is now saying "Ministers wrote to Primary Care Trusts in December 2006 asking them to take action to ensure that patients phoning GP practices do not pay more than theywould if they called an area code number."

This means they should either use 01/02 numbers or the new 03 numbers.

~ Edited by Dave: Quote box tidied up

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« Last Edit: Sep 14^th, 2007 at 12:09pm by Dave »

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kk

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #38 - Sep 14^th, 2007 at 11:49am

Hi loddon,

You said in your last post:

“....The NHS is now saying "Ministers wrote to Primary Care Trusts in December 2006 asking them to take action to ensure that patients phoning GP practices do not pay more than they would if they called an area code number."
This means they should either use 01/02 numbers or the new 03 numbers. ....”

Do you have a reference to what NHS is now saying, together with a copy of the December 06 letter? This information may be useful to quote to errant doctors.

kk

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KK

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Dave Global Moderator Offline Posts: 9,902 Yorkshire Gender:	Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844 Reply #39 - Sep 14^th, 2007 at 12:36pm kk wrote on Sep 14^th, 2007 at 11:49am: Do you have a reference to what NHS is now saying, together with a copy of the December 06 letter? The letter from Lord Warner can be downloaded here.
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SilentCallsVictim

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #40 - Sep 14^th, 2007 at 1:07pm

Dave wrote on Sep 14^th, 2007 at 12:36pm:

The letter from Lord Warner can be downloaded

One may see that this letter makes no reference whatsoever to the permissibility of revenue sharing. Revenue sharing has always been precluded by the specified terms of the mandatory elements of the GMS contract, which are imposed as a statutory requirement on PCTs.

The letter does nothing to change that position, one way or the other. This is obviously a serious omission, which must now be corrected by clarification from the Department of Health - Are NHS services "free at the point of use" or not?

David

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@fairtelecoms (tweets)

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pw4

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #41 - Sep 14^th, 2007 at 1:41pm

loddon wrote on Sep 14^th, 2007 at 8:55am:

pw4, as I mentioned before and as your quote from 24/02/05 says, GP practices then using 0870 were required to change their number to something else which was acceptable, but other doctors were not "encouraged" to go to 0844.

Yes, I take your point - practices were not explicitly encouraged by the DH to adopt 0844 in place of geo numbers, but I would suggest they were led to believe that 0844 was acceptable because those using premium and 'national' rate numbers were required to change to 0844 (and funding made available for the purpose), and because the DH in the same announcment described them as "'lo-call' rate numbers" and numbers "that offer patients a guaranteed low rate call, such as '0845' or '0844'".

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NGMsGhost

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #42 - Sep 14^th, 2007 at 8:43pm

loddon wrote on Sep 12^th, 2007 at 5:39pm:

If anyone living in the South West could check on the local regional BBC TV evening news programme they may find that the BBC are running an item about doctors using 0844 numbers! If you do see it could you let us know here what is said on the prog.

Anyone who has Sky would be able to watch the South West BBC1 channel regardless of where they are located in the UK.

Sadly due to unknown powers on this website again desubscribing me from this thread I was unaware of the program until now when it is too late. Sad

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loddon Supreme Member Offline Posts: 599 Reading UK Gender:	Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844 Reply #43 - Sep 14^th, 2007 at 9:49pm NGM, I have sent a link to this as a broadcast clip to your email address. Hope it works.
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NGMsGhost

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Re: Radio Broadcast about doctors using 0844
Reply #44 - Aug 19^th, 2008 at 7:04pm

You may be interested in reading the thread I have just started about the money spent by 10 Downing Street in making a video posted on the YouTube website to respond to the Make Jeremy Clarkson PM petition compared to their responses to our various anti 084/7 petitions.

See www.saynoto0870.com/cgi-bin/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1219172169

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