sherbert wrote on Feb 10^th, 2010 at 4:03pm:

Thanks for this, Sherbert. After a momentary pause for thought, I believe that I understand your position. The NHS continues to retain a strong legacy of the position that you advocate, from the past, however for most of us times have moved on. Many see the situation moving on again to produce the situation that you support, however you and I are thereby set in total opposition.

Surely the concept of the NHS was originally, and it still is, that each shall receive according to his need (and free of charge at the point of need) while each shall contribute or pay (via his taxes) according to his means?    It was always recognised that the NHS had to be paid for somehow in order to enable everyone to benefit from it no matter how impoverished they may be.

SilentCallsVictim wrote on Feb 10^th, 2010 at 4:58pm:


From the C.A.B. site     http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/your_money/benefits/national_insurance_contr...



National insurance contributions also go towards the costs of the National Health Service.


So it can't be free.

derrick wrote on Feb 10^th, 2010 at 2:04pm:
And, in the context of this discussion and by local convention and the general public perception, this is correct - the calls are free, that is there is no cost for making an unlimited number of local calls. We can spend hours debating the ins and outs of the word 'free', and, as is often pointed out, little, if anything is truly free'. In the context of this thread, however, I will maintain that the calling plan to which I subscribe provides free local calls. It is a fair and accurate description.

I have absolutely no choice in the local calling provision. My plan, Complete Choice Enhanced, combines basic phone service with eleven calling features (possibly known as star services in the UK) shown below. The AT&T basic phone service is the lowest available tariff ^(*) to a residential subscriber here. I cannot remove local calling. I cannot unbundle or exclude a potential 44640 local monthly minutes from the plan. The free local calls are, if you like, a side-effect of having basic phone service. I have not requested any service other than for AT&T to provide me with a line (plus my selected calling features), and that is exactly what I get for my money - a line (plus my selected calling features).

Looking at my latest bill, there is no mention of local calling anywhere on the invoice, just an indication that I have a residential line (plus some of my selected calling features; no idea why all are not shown) on the $26 plan indicated:

Monthly Service - Jan 11 thru Feb 10

1. Complete Choice® Enhanced 26.00 ^(**)

Residential Line
Three-Way Calling
Call Waiting ID
Call Return
Caller-ID Name-Number Delivery
Anonymous Call Blocking

Nowhere on the bill is there any indication of having made any local calls. The only calls itemized are the 119 minutes of LD calls that I made, for which I pay $4 per month for unlimited (note, not free as I have a choice) nationwide calls. I could make 44600 minutes of calls to Los Angeles should I so desire, at a cost of $4 - not free.

People may require a line for various reasons - emergency 911 use, alarm signalling, a safety net in case of power outage (common here), an incoming service only, and for various other requirements. Each line has the ability to makle an unlimited number of free local calls.



* Some, perhaps most, perhaps all, states offer lower cost plans for low-income families. This may be determined on a county basis, I really don't know. An example in California provides an incoming line only for a couple of dollars per month and an incoming line with sixty minutes of local calls for around three dollars per month. I have no idea what is available in FL and whether it is determined by the county or by the state.

** Complete Choice Enhanced combines the $13.68 basic phone service with eleven other calling features: Caller ID, Call Waiting ID  OR Call Waiting, Call Return, Three-Way Calling, Call Forwarding OR Remote Access to Call Forwarding, Call Blocking, Anonymous Call Blocking, Speed Dial 8, Call Trace, RingMaster®1 OR RingMaster®2, Selective Call Forwarding

It seems that after "Big Brother" and "Room 101" it is time for "Newspeak" to come from the pages of 1984 into common language.

The improper application of "political correctness" causes some to urge for words that have the potential for misuse or for causing offence to be removed from the language.

Perhaps those who I am implicitly accusing of supporting Winston Smith's work at Minitrue would like to offer a meaningful definition of the word "free", with examples of where it could be used properly.

(Wikipedia contains articles that may be of use to those who are unfamiliar with the book and wish to fully understand my comments)

derrick wrote on Feb 11^th, 2010 at 2:32pm:



That, derrick, if I may so, is a perfect description of what, you, I & others have been trying to put accross. Thanks

derrick wrote on Feb 11^th, 2010 at 10:41am:
If I don't part with the cash, I lose the ability to make free local calls. No more, no less. To me, it's a very straightforward concept.

derrick wrote on Feb 13^th, 2010 at 9:26am:
Your argument is nonsensical and flawed and your definition too narrow. There is little benefit in continuing this aspect of the discussion. All I would suggest is that you may wish to carry out a little research into local calling provision here and the legal obligations and heavy regulation that define such provision across fifty separate entities. It is a very different beast to what you may be familiar with.